2.0 CR TDI Timing Belts... Volkswagen Timing Belts in general.

Hey everyone,

I'm sitting here writing this, and I'm so angry that steam is practically coming out of my ears. Does anyone happen to know how to adjust the camshaft timing on an EA189 engine? Specifically, which tooth engages with which?

It can't be serious that you have to mount and dismount the valve cover five times before finding the right position where the slot on the back of the camshaft is somewhat aligned with the edge of the cylinder head.


...which then leads me to a point of contention that has been ongoing for 20 years. What was going through the minds of those at Volkswagen when they were figuring out how to control and manipulate the timing of their engines?
Warum, muß die KW Ot Marke durch ein Loch in der Getriebeglocke erstmal unter Rost freigelegt werden. Und warum ist es zwingend notwendig mindestens den Ventildeckel zu demontieren um die Steuerzeiten der Nocke zu kontrollieren. Kein anderer Großserienhersteller bricht sich dabei so einen ab wie der VAG Konzern.... Um den Kreis zu schließen, ich möchte nicht wissen wie viele 2.0 CR mit einer verstellten Nockenwelle durch die Gegend fahren. AnInstead of adding three detent balls to the mechanism from the factory, which would indicate where each tooth should align.

...the trick is probably similar to that used with 2.5-liter overhead cam engines: assemble the timing gears without the rocker arms first, and then set the timing marks yourself.

Just to give you an idea, I recently had a Opel 2.8 V6 Turbo in my shop that needed timing chain replacement. The owner couldn't find anyone willing to do the job. I had it scheduled for two days with a possible third day because the engine might need to be removed. It has three chains, four camshaft adjusters, balance shafts, and the oil pump – all connected under one cover. I've never done this before, and I didn't have any instructions for it. What can I say? Any mechanic should be able to do this with basic tools in a single day. The whole thing is designed according to the Poka Yoke principle; you simply can't assemble it incorrectly. Changing the timing belt on a TDI engine is less complicated than this.

Hi,

Did I miss something? Do you have any pictures?

Best regards, Rainer.

"I had to replace the camshafts. They are connected to each other via a toothed coupling. You can fix the exhaust camshaft with a 6mm dowel pin if the camshaft cover is fully assembled. The intake camshaft, as usual for VW, is aligned using a ruler on the cylinder head. However, this can only be done if the camshaft cover is missing. The problem is that the camshafts rotate when tightening the cover, so you lose the initial setting no matter what you do."

Ich hab mir die Lösung aber schon selbst genannt, man muß die Schlepphebel rausnehmen, dann können die Nocken so in die Gassen gelegt und abgesteckt werden, danach kann man die Position mit Lack zueinander markieren. Problem hierbei war mein kalibriertes Auge ich hatte bei der ersten Montage eine Abweichung festgestellt, die Nocke war nicht in Flucht mit der Kopf-Planfläche wenn abgesteckt. Das Gleiche habe ich dann mit dem Abstecklineal festgestellt, die Nockenwellen (FEBI) sind in der Verzahnung nicht passend zum Kopf. Einen Zahn weniger oder mehr ist aber noch weiter weg. I reluctantly chose the option with the least bad value.
The whole problem could have been avoided if the gears had a marking (e.g., "tooth X on base Y"). This would also prevent the 180-degree rotation, as the centering slot is in the middle.


The whole thing is incredibly poorly designed. A single design flaw can cause the entire engine to fail.

Hi there,
When assembling with the installation tool, a positioning gauge is used to lock the intake camshaft, and a cover is used to lock the exhaust camshaft (for RLF EA188 Gen.2 and CJCD engines).
hg
Herbert.

Okay, here's the translation:

"Edit: of course, it's an EA189 Gen.2."

I was almost certain that this poor design would require another set of specialized tools, like a wheelbarrow full. And then for the 288 model, it's all over again – there's no other way; a new engine means new tools.

I now have almost a whole room full of obsolete tools simply because the people at Volkswagen are too incompetent to come up with something better, cheaper, or more sensible.

It's not that Volkswagen lacks the invested capital; it's simply poorly executed. It frustrates me because things could be simpler and more affordable for everyone.

Just think about the "dieselgate" scandal at Volkswagen. So much capital was wasted for absolutely nothing.

I'm having trouble understanding your approach and your criticism.
The crankshaft has been fixed in the top dead center (TDC) position since the end of the Variable Valve Timing (VVT) era using a crankshaft locking tool, not through a viewing hole.
The two camshafts are assembled in a specific position: first, each is set to Top Dead Center (TDC) individually, then joined together and placed into the bearing housing. There is no phase offset. Finally, the bearing housing with the two fixed camshafts is mounted onto the crankshaft. The spur gears prevent the camshafts from being mounted individually onto the crankshaft.
hg
Herbert.

Good morning, Herbert.
The timing issue is actually quite simple. It doesn't require a mark on the crankshaft pulley or a wave stopper. The standard solution used by most manufacturers is a mark on the crankshaft that needs to be aligned with a mark on the engine block. Alternatively, some, like with chain engines, simply have marks on the sprockets and belt that need to be aligned. That's it. Most manufacturers figured this out sometime in the 70s when they switched to timing belts, and they stuck with it because there was nothing to improve upon.

Kein Zweiter zum Gucken nötig weil man nicht drehen und gucken kann gleichzeitig (T4 5 Zylinder z.B.), kein Raten welcher Stopp nun der richtige ist (auf die Schnelle hatte ich bei mir 3 Stopps gefunden die alle gepasst haben 2 Unterschieden sich nur evtl. einen viertel Zahn. Zudem (Im Falle der Schwungscheibe) Motoren lassen sich auf dem Motorständer auch nicht komplettieren da weder Schwungscheibe noch Getriebe vorhanden sind. For troubleshooting, you can't just quickly check the engine's valve timing, etc.

Ultimately, the mere presence of various paint marks on older TDI engines indicates that even a regular mechanic working with VWs doesn't necessarily agree with this approach. You rarely find such things on older Renault, Fiat, Ford, Opel, etc. The same applies to adjusted timing chains/pumps, which are almost exclusively found in VWs.

It all costs money, whether it's time or tools, and it's completely unnecessary.

Regarding the adjustment of camshafts for a 189 engine. The camshafts are far from clearly marked, as there are no reference points, as mentioned. Even with the original VW tool, it's possible to install the intake camshaft rotated 180 degrees and not realize it if the cylinder head has already been mounted. Also, what is this excessive amount of specialized tools required for such a simple task?That's exactly my point. They were already attaching the engraving machine to the gear anyway, so why didn't they just engrave three more points instead of constructing this entire frame?
Okay, I mean, it probably costs only 1-2 cents per engine, but there are plenty of other parts in the engine where significant cost savings could be achieved, like the camshaft wheel, for example... why make it so complicated? The original indexing tool has much more play than the manufacturing tolerance of a timing belt. So why not simply use a one-piece camshaft wheel with a protrusion cast on for the crankshaft position sensor? No large-scale manufacturer makes freely adjustable camshaft wheels for timing belts, except for VW.
It's important to view this against the backdrop of the current crisis. Problems that were created internally and are still lingering from the era of Ferdinand Piëch certainly haven't been entirely innocent in causing it.

This is what happens when the journey is the goal – and of course, with maximum effort/cost for non-brand workshops .

A lot of what they call "specialized tools" is as useful as a pimple on your backside... I just see the overall package, and that's okay for me.

I also used a piercing needle for the balance wave module from BRE (various gears), and I didn't make a complicated project out of it.

Quote:

Die Standardlösung ist bei den meisten Herstellern eine Marke an der Kurbelwelle die in Flucht mit einer Marke am Block gebracht wird.

Okay, very precise. I'm opting out of that discussion; it doesn't make sense. The only thing that bothered me was the complaining about work that was done with a rough estimate.
hg
Herbert.

Well, maybe there's a simple solution? Since I haven't done this on that engine before, I can't really say much about it.

Pictures would have been great, as I'm likely to need a Zylinderkopfrevision (cylinder head overhaul) on a similar engine soon.