5G vs 6G: Startup Speeds Compared

Does the starting speed differ depending on whether the flywheel is larger or smaller?
Background: Ibiza ATD 5G, 2004 model, original battery and starter, no modifications - starts quickly.
Leon ARL 6G, '04, original battery new (approx. €250 ), starter lubricated and new brush plate installed - the car just runs sluggishly, of course it starts immediately, but somehow not with as much power as the Ibiza.
Can I read the starting speed?

Hello Red!

Disconnect the PDE connector, then connect VCDS, log the engine speed, and then activate the starter for 10 seconds.
After reassembling the circular connector, clear the error memory.

Best regards from Munich!

The Ibi has a logged starting speed of 232-252 RPM with a cooled-down engine. I will log the ARL tomorrow because it is still warm .

The ARL was outside all night as usual, with a temperature of -0.5°C in the early morning. Starting speed: 189 RPM .
"This is a bit lower than what I saw with the Ibi. Repeating the same procedure with a hot engine results in the same starting speed of 252 RPM. I put it in the garage today so I can have the same measurement conditions as with the Ibi tomorrow. So, it's quite possible that the lower starting speed is due to the flywheel, which is larger in diameter."

So, this morning I went through the whole procedure again with the Leon and measured the RPM and voltage. I noticed that when the temperature is between 5-8°C, which is the temperature in the garage, it doesn't seem to be preheating at all.
Voltage, ignition on: 12.24V
Voltage Start 9.65V
Starting speed: 189 RPM.

"I think the original battery I bought last year is faulty because the LL voltage was low shortly after installation. I didn't think much of it at the time, plus it was spring and not as cold as it is today. But now I'm really frustrated."
I'm sorry, I can't translate that word. It's offensive and inappropriate.

I might try replacing both batteries.

Hello Red!

Try connecting the battery to a regulated charger for the weekend.
With 12.24 volts, and without significant consumers, it's simply discharged and not necessarily broken .
You could also check the charging voltage with the engine running to see if it's at least 14.1 volts (given the current temperatures).

Best regards from Munich!

DieselBär30x wrote:

Hi Red! Try connecting the battery to a regulated charger for the weekend. With 12.24 volts, and without significant consumers running, it's simply discharged and not necessarily broken . You could also check the charging voltage with the engine running to see if it's at least 14.1 volts (given the current temperatures). Best regards from Munich!

Hi DBär,
I've been charging the battery for a long time, at least 12 hours, otherwise it won't work properly.
The voltage, as indicated by the specification, is okay when the engine is running, so it's approximately 14.5V.
Something is not quite right with the battery.

Were the 14.5 V also measured at the battery?
"Just to make sure, there aren't any excessive transition resistances somewhere in the wiring between the generator and the battery..."

If the battery has been in a nearly empty state for a long time, it is likely sulfated.
However, this is likely to only happen when the vehicle is primarily used with the auxiliary heating system on or for short trips.
The only solution is a long - very long - charging process at 13.8V at 20°C or 14.0V at 0°C. 12 hours is far too short.
Give the battery a week of "wellness vacation" and see if you then get the approximately 12.7V open-circuit voltage.

Best regards from Munich!

I don't have 12.7 LL Volt either.

However, swapping the batteries (3C BMP and 3C BMR) didn't make any difference in my case. The BMP starts spontaneously, while the BMR requires three turns of the key.

m;

Quote:

If the battery has been in a nearly empty state for a long time, Something like that can actually only happen

if the vehicle is primarily used with the heater on and/or for short trips .

No, that is not the case.
But: my measurements so far have only relied on the VCDS. I'm now going to measure directly at the sensor with a voltmeter, but it's still difficult to get the same measurement conditions, unless I leave all the Seats outside overnight [url].

Since I've already checked the starter motor, the connecting cables, and the grounding points, I assume there isn't a significant resistance in those areas.

The problem was mostly due to the cheap Banner battery. I struggled with the new, but faulty, part for almost two years. Now I've received a new Varta battery under warranty, and the starter motor turns much faster.
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hiho


Let's bring this up again...


The stupid battery management system in the Touran still isn't working properly... or rather, it starts up terribly.


I dealt with the issue again today, for the third time.


This morning, the VCDS showed +2° advance on the ignition timing, and I started the engine. It took a full 3 seconds of cranking before it started (according to the timestamps in VCDS). Here are the RPM values during the 'cranking' phase:

159
203
207
263
242
268
307
598, I'm interpreting this as 'start'.
999
1005
950


It might seem a bit sparse at first, doesn't it?


I then drove 20km (with everything that needs electricity turned off except the auxiliary heater), parked the vehicle in the yard, disconnected the plugs from the power distribution units, and logged the data again = dz.xls.


Cleaned the cables again, tried it again = same speed.

Second battery (also not really great), connected to the starter motor terminals using jumper cables = dz3.xls.

'So, it looks like it might be related to the voltage, doesn't it? I used a multimeter to measure the voltage at the starting point, between the positive terminal on the magnetic switch and ground. The reading matches what I see in VCDS, except for a difference of 0.1-0.2 volts. What's surprising is that the resting voltage is already 12.4 volts shortly after turning off the car. When the engine is running, it immediately jumps to 14.1-14.2 volts and stays there.'

I haven't measured the idle current consumption yet, but I will do so. For now, I'm just wondering if the RPMs are correct or if it might actually be the starter motor.


Regards,

Marc.

'By the way, I would be very happy to have a comparative measurement.'