What exactly is the purpose of preheating when using a pellet stove?

Hello!

I've been following various activities for quite some time now.
from vegetable oil - drivers and providers of conversion kits.
Unfortunately, very little to no specific information can be found.
regarding the VP-TDI, which is the type I have.

Most people claim that it is sufficient to place the fuel between the filter and the...
Preheating the ESP (Electrostatically Precipitator, possibly using electric heating and/or a heat exchanger).
And additionally, pre-heating the air before it reaches the filter would be beneficial.

But somehow, I don't quite understand it.

Either the fuel can still be pumped, in which case I'll need some too.
No preheating required, the fuel is already warmed in the ESP, correct?

If the fuel can't be pumped, then it's useless, even if...
Preheating doesn't work. It's impossible to start it anyway. Or am I missing something?

Wouldn't it be more sensible to simply use thicker fuel lines from the tank?
and possibly to heat the filter electrically?

hollari wrote:

Either the fuel can still be pumped, and if so, I need it too. No preheating required, the fuel is already warmed in the ESP, correct? If the fuel can't be pumped, then it's useless, even if... Preheating doesn't work. It's impossible to start it anyway. Or am I missing something?

While your initial thoughts are correct, the preheating helps to reduce the load on the ESP. Operating with a cold exhaust gas temperature (EGT) is far outside the ESP (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) specification, but it can only be avoided with extreme effort during startup; once the engine is running, it's much easier to manage using EGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) and preheating.

Regards,
Guste.

Okay, I understand, but the moment I start...
The fuel in the lines and also in the filter is cold.

That doesn't change anything, regardless of any additional heating device.

Even if the fuel is already circulating, it still needs to...
The entire fuel tank contents should warm up, including the fuel supply line.
Warm fuel is flowing. What I doubt, however, is that the lines...
are located on the underside of the car, in the 'open' area, and are...
thus cooled by the wind.

-> That is, where the stress is greatest, namely during startup.
That won't achieve anything.

And later on, the benefit (for me) remains quite questionable.

In my opinion, the main effect is that the battery simply discharges faster.
giving up hope -> even more uncertain start!

Even if the fuel is already circulating, then it must first...
The entire fuel tank contents should warm up, all the way to the fuel supply line.
Warm fuel is flowing. http://bilder50.parsimony.net/forum200532/TempMessungen_Ergebnis_c.pdf

No, all newer diesel engines (from the 90s onwards) have the EGR valve (Exhaust Gas Recirculation), which is often prone to failure and can cause issues like air leaks.

It seems quite complicated, but as far as I can see, it confirms my assumption.

The temperature at the injectors remains unchanged.
The fuel injection pump is only relieved under warm cooling water conditions.

Even without a heat exchanger, the load isn't that high anymore.

-> It's absolutely pointless to install something like that.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

It's absolutely pointless to install something like that.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

If you've ever been stranded in the winter because of a malfunctioning ESP (Electronic Stability Program) or a clogged DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter), then you know how useful something like this is.

Here's my measurement from this morning.

A waste heat recovery system could have saved a significant amount of energy that would otherwise have been lost to the ESP.

The main reason for heating the wort is to improve its filterability.
However, electric preheating is really pointless (I have a Bosch diesel heater installed, which doesn't do anything with its 150 watts).

The main reason why you heat up the wort is for filterability!


If you've ever been or have stood in front of a sulfurized DiFi, then you know how useful something like that can be .

Sure, just make it a bit clearer.

Electric preheating is really nonsense (I have a Bosch diesel heater installed, which doesn't do anything with its 150 watts)

So, my homemade 150-watt incandescent light bulb heater actually works quite well. The exhaust gases exiting the system are noticeably warmer than those entering, and the brass block heats up during the preheating phase, providing pre-warmed exhaust gases immediately after the engine starts.

So, my 150-watt immersion heater (homemade) definitely works well. The pre-chamber exits noticeably warmer than it enters, and the brass block heats up during the preheating phase, providing warmed pre-chamber air immediately after the engine starts.

It will provide some heating during the initial phase, but unlike the 'Eckes' wood-burning stove with its approximately 2 kW output, the heating power is quite low. I just wanted to express that you should always prefer a KW heat exchanger over any kind of electric heater.

I just wanted to express that you should always prefer a KW heat exchanger over any kind of electric heater.

The very fact that KW heat exchangers utilize waste heat already proves you're right. However, after a cold start in winter, the ESP may require almost 100% of its existing electrode material to generate even a small amount of heating power, regardless of its source.

My electric heater shuts off at 50°C on the hot air side, or at 65°C on the brass block.

Sure, it's already beneficial just a few minutes after starting.

But:

Why isn't the filter 'dirty' during a cold start, but then becomes 'dirty' later?
'If the critical cold start phase is already over!?'

I once tried using 70% rapeseed oil in my car (a 1995 Golf 3 TDI).
(and a cooled-down vehicle) to start at approximately 0 degrees.

Even with 'manual' pre-glow (I installed a button for it), it's almost impossible.

It probably has nothing to do with filter compatibility or anything like that, or am I wrong?

Why is the filter not 'sulfurized' during cold start, and then 'sulfurized' later?
when the critical cold start phase is already over?!?


Imagine a sieve that gradually gets clogged as you pour the soup with the herbs (leeks, etc.) through it (maybe watch while cooking sometime ).

The filter behaves in a similar way.

I once tried using 70% rapeseed oil in my vehicle (a Golf 3 TDI, manufactured in 1995).
(and with a cooled-down vehicle) to start at approximately 0 degrees.

Even with 'manual' pre-glow (I installed a button for it), it's almost impossible.


Stat. Injection start for the fuel too late, worn-out nozzles, individual glow plugs defective, lack of compression?! There are many possible causes.

However, it probably has nothing to do with filter compatibility or anything like that, or am I wrong about that?

Yes, it usually has nothing to do with it, unless the filter is completely blocked (clogged), which typically happens at temperatures between -10°C and -20°C.

My electric heater shuts off at 50°C on the hot air side, or 65°C on the brass block.
My Bosch appliance does that by default, but I prefer to use a simple manual switch that I can turn on and off as I please.

Is your electric heater also located before the filter? I measure the temperature of the exhaust pipe, among other things, just before the entrance to the ESP, and I can't detect any difference whether the heater is on or not...
Perhaps I should also isolate my filter sometime!
So far, I've actually been doing quite well with it. I'm getting these readings with the great August temperatures (10°C this morning) – 100% pressure with approximately 0.4 bar.

The best thing would be if we could heat the ESP itself a little.

@Nebelwerfer_TDI:

I really hope there's no soup with herbs or anything like that in my gas tank.


Seriously:
I've already tried a few 'freezing experiments' with PÖL and RAPSÖL.

Temperature in my freezer: approximately -20 degrees Celsius.

RAPSÖL 100%: Freezes. It becomes solid like wax when it freezes, but softens when thawed.
Does it melt like wax from a burning candle?

Vegetable oil (from the supermarket): It becomes thick, like honey. When thawing...
It suddenly becomes fluid again.

Blend 50/50%: Behaves exactly like 100% rapeseed oil. Is there more?
slightly thicker -> mixes perfectly, doesn't clump or separate.

As a result of this, I would say that with pure oil from the supermarket, that's where...
It doesn't clog anything; either it goes through, or it simply won't.
Then, the only remaining option is to heat the filter directly.
(Either electrically or with a standing heater; but definitely BEFORE starting), because...
The preheated oil from the heat exchanger was not being pumped to the filter at all.
can be done.


Regarding the condition of the engine:
Spark plugs are okay.
The engine has approximately 200,000 kilometers.
Starts in less than 1 second at -30 degrees Celsius without preheating (when using 100% diesel).
Where should I start looking?
Can the static injection timing, which is responsible for starting the engine, be adjusted?

Quote:

Is it possible to adjust the static injection timing, which is responsible for starting the engine?

Sure.

Rotate the pump, set Block 000 to the default settings, and adjust it to the _upper_ line.
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