Motorsteuergerät defekt oder was anderes? | Posts 16+

Heute hab ich ein anderes Kombiinstrument eingebaut und getestet. That...
It's clear that the car won't start because the immobilizer system hasn't been properly programmed.
But here's the interesting part: The diagnosis also came with...
other AI systems don't. It only stops when I disconnect the engine control unit.
Re-diagnosing the AI. So, I don't think it's due to...
Combination instrument.

Meanwhile (even before I installed the new AI), the following is stated in the...
Fehlerspeicher des MSTG dass das Gerät gesperrt ist. I'm afraid that...
I would probably have to unlock it anyway because it's been tried too many times.
The process was supposed to start, but the approval is missing.

There is no such thing as "too often" .
The error occurs as soon as the MSTG starts up without communication with the WFS.
and can be easily deleted (once everything is back to normal).
If I understand correctly, you're coming to the MSTG if it doesn't match the vehicle.
"is connected to and, when the MSTG is disconnected, transmits data to other control units."
Either the K-line (possibly damaged during an attempted theft) is faulty in the wiring harness.
"damaged" or an overloaded control unit is putting too much strain on it.
If you have the opportunity, you could use an oscilloscope to check the signal levels.
Consider the best-case and worst-case scenarios.

Best regards,
Micha

Unfortunately, my software is only a demo version. Normally, I can reset the errors, but not the "locked" error. Another error message appears, but it's not displayed clearly due to software limitations. However, perhaps it cannot be deleted because something is actually wrong.

Sometimes the MSTG (Main System Terminal Gateway) didn't respond correctly, and data transfer was intermittent. Strangely enough, it worked quite well towards the end. However, the error seems to have a somewhat sporadic nature because the car sometimes wouldn't start, but then would work again. When I accessed the MSTG, the entire car system seemed to be initialized. The instrument cluster (KI) couldn't be accessed at all. What's strange is that the K-line connects to the instrument cluster and then goes back to the MSTG.

"Using an oscilloscope to analyze the K-line in a good/bad scenario is a good idea. If I had an oscilloscope with a battery... And which K-line? The diagnostic connector AI or the AI-MSTG? Or both? Or is it perhaps just a single line that's passed through in the AI?"

In the MSTG (presumably a piece of equipment), I'm measuring 100kΩ from the K-line to ground. This means the load can't be constantly too high. However, an integrated circuit or transistor might pull the voltage up or down when it's in operation.

I don't think the connector was damaged during the attempted theft. And even if it was, then no diagnostic functions should work at all, not just when the MSTG is missing...

I've ordered a new MSTG (Multi-System Tester Gateway) and I hope that will fix the problem. Then, all I need is the ADAC to tow the car to Volkswagen.

Does anyone have an idea what the total cost of reprogramming will be? And do I need to have all the keys with me? The problem is, I can't find one of them right now...

@Stefan_2.0TDI: You have a private message!

The madness continues to a new level...

I once removed the windshield wiper to check the connectors in the water reservoir. Visually and in terms of connector strength, they seemed fine. After reassembling everything, I tried starting it again. It still wouldn't start. Then I restarted the laptop to check the error memory again and see if the diagnostics would work this time. While the laptop was still booting up, I tried starting it one more time, and lo and behold: it started! Yay!! So, I didn't turn it off again and was finally able to drive home.

"As soon as it started, I checked the error memory and it indicated that the glow plug relay was having intermittent problems. I then had some values read out and drove off while the connection was still active. At some point during the drive, I heard a clicking sound, and at that moment, the diagnostic process stopped. During the rest of the drive, the clicking became more frequent. Eventually, it sounded like a relay was chattering. Interestingly, this was load-dependent on the engine. At idle, it clicks roughly once per second, and the more load on the engine, the stronger the chatter."

Back home, I identified the relay and determined which one it was. It's relay 103, which controls the glow plugs. Now I wondered if my actions while checking the connectors might have introduced an additional error, but I really can't imagine that because the connectors were verschandeln and dry, and they clicked back into place properly.

Even if I had disconnected the control signal from the relay, nothing should have clicked because the MSTG (presumably a sensor or module) shouldn't be supplying any voltage to the relay coil when the engine is warm, right? That's why I also think I can rule out a faulty relay.

I find it strange that the diagnosis for the MSTG (presumably a specific system or component) stops exactly at the moment when something "clicks." Of course, I don't know if other relays might also be involved. Is there a relay that absolutely *must* be engaged for the diagnosis to run? I didn't see anything in the wiring diagram that obviously requires it, but you never know.

The engine was running smoothly when it was running, without any hesitation. When I turned it off, I could start it again almost immediately, but only about one out of every three times. This was true regardless of whether the relay 103 was plugged in or not. The diagnosis was also possible independently of the relay.

I can imagine that the MSTG is damaged, which is why it's doing something so nonsensical. I hope that's the case. The question is, why? Maybe it was even killed by a power surge because the freewheeling diode in the relay is defective? You never know... (as Stefan Raab would say ).

Outsider wrote:

... At some point during the drive, I heard a clicking sound, and at that moment, the diagnostic process stopped. ...

The clicking sound comes from the instrument cluster (IC), and it's the relay that switches the MSTG diagnostic signal to the diagnostic connector. If the relay in the IC fails (for any reason), your diagnostic connection will be lost.
This switching mechanism is located within the immobilizer ASIC, which is housed in the ECU (Engine Control Unit).

I'm starting to believe there's a very ordinary cable fault (short circuit or break) between the KI and MSTG.

Quote:

I can imagine that the MSTG is damaged and that's why it's doing something so nonsensical. I hope that's the case, at least. The question is, why? Perhaps it was even killed by a power surge because the freewheeling diode in the relay is defective?

Flyback diodes are not installed in relays. The flyback diodes needed for the device are instead mounted directly on the components that need to be protected. Otherwise, there will be problems with electromagnetic compatibility (EMC) safety.

I've looked at it again carefully. There are two different clicking sounds coming from separate locations. One seems to be coming from the combination meter and sounds like a relay engaging during a diagnostic attempt, then disengaging after about 1-2 seconds. About one second later, K103 engages and then disengages as well. You can also see that a lot of current is being drawn based on the onboard voltage, which would be consistent with K103 being the relay for the preheating system.

It's strange, but when I disconnect the K103 relay, the diagnostic function of the instrument cluster works. I've plugged and unplugged it multiple times, and it's definitely reproducible. Since it clicks a second after the click in the instrument cluster, I don't think there's a short circuit somewhere in the wiring harness or at the relay socket to other signals. However, it's odd that the K103 relay, which is supposed to be controlled by the MSTG (Main System Terminal), clicks when I try to run the instrument cluster diagnostic, which should only affect the instrument cluster itself. If it weren't too complicated, I would disconnect the control wire from the MSTG to the K103 at the MSTG connector and see if there are any voltage changes on that line. But since I'm getting a new MSTG next week anyway, and I suspect it might be defective, I won't bother doing that right now. It will still be enough for me to see if the new MSTG fixes the problem.

Okay, I'll probably need to troubleshoot the KI (K-line) and MSTG (multiplex switch transmission gateway) systems. I'll also check the continuity of the diagnostic line between the KI and MSTG, ensuring it's connected properly and measuring for shorts to ground or other signals. Based on experience, what's the best way to identify bad connections, like the one I suspect? Should I measure continuity while wiggling all the connectors on the wiring harness?

Okay, after weeks of torment, I seem to have found the bug.
He would sometimes be there, and sometimes not. If the temperature was below freezing, he would disappear.
Once he had finished his work, he returned. He used the oscilloscope on the diagnostic line.
I was finally able to locate him. The problem was just the most...
There was a time when the error simply didn't exist.

The Bosch service was established approximately 8 years ago.
For years, I've been installing auxiliary heaters, and one screw is always right in the middle of...
The wiring harness was properly connected. It seems that it has now frayed through.
and caused various errors. They were difficult to see because the cable harness was located directly against the metal panel where the screw emerged.

Die Frage die sich mir jetzt stellt: kann ich die haftbar machen? I.
weiß es ist lange her und Garantie etc. abgelaufen. But what they...
what they did was actually life-threatening; it could have also damaged the car.
can be set on fire or something else. If something really had happened, there would have been...
die ja auch haftbar. Ich finde so eine Fahrlässigkeit ungeheuerlich! The
"Back then, TÜV also inspected the entire thing and didn't notice anything."
"Sloppy work. Nowadays, you don't even need to install auxiliary heaters anymore."
enter.

With replacement parts, and unsuccessful troubleshooting at the workshop...
The damage from replacement parts and downtime amounts to approximately 1000 euros.
Do they have insurance for that? Or are they willing to cover something like that?
"Do I need to pay? Or do I actually have to (do something for the first time in my life)?"
Consult a lawyer and sue them to make them cover the costs?

In addition to that, there are also the costs for the current repair, which still...
I just remembered something related to that. How is something like that actually done?
Gibts Kabelbäume oder Kabelbaumstücke als Ersatzteil? OHe will do something like that.
Simply unraveled and patched?

Outsider wrote:

Are there wiring harnesses or sections of wiring harnesses available as spare parts?

No, just the entire wiring harness. But it's not a problem to have it professionally repaired.

You want to hold someone accountable for something that happened 8 years ago? Come on, you have to almost laugh about that.

Laugh? No. That was a terrible experience. And whether it happened 8 years ago or 2 weeks ago: The mistake is outrageous. If I hadn't spent weeks troubleshooting and fixing it myself, the cost of finding the problem and getting replacement parts would have been more than the car is even worth. Many, many days without a car, repeatedly stuck in ridiculous places, in the worst weather imaginable, and about 1000 euros in damages. No, I can't laugh about that. I'm trying my best not to let my anger out, and I will first politely ask the person responsible if they would consider some form of compensation.

"I imagine someone who can laugh about it either hasn't experienced something like that themselves, or they are a mechanic and have made similar mistakes before. If the mistake is corrected and acknowledged, I think that's fine; everyone makes mistakes sometimes, and that's not really an issue. But something needs to be done."

What I've experienced, especially with Volkswagen, is actually unbelievable! For example, they drove away with damaged sills and then painted over the crack with red paint so that I wouldn't notice when I left the yard...

Don't get me wrong, it's definitely bad, really bad even. But after 8 years, that's a joke. Does the Bosch service even still exist?
It's just one of those things that happened, as harsh as it may sound. I can understand why you're upset.

....
The Bosch service technician, when he installed the auxiliary heater about 8 years ago, screwed a screw directly into the wiring harness.
...
Can I hold them liable?
...


After eight years? So, after the expiration of all deadlines for liability due to material defects?
That will likely be difficult. You would need to prove that no one else has touched this screw since then. Also, proving that the screw actually came from the original installation and wasn't installed later during other work might also be quite challenging.
In any case, you are fully responsible for providing the evidence, and you will also have to cover any costs associated with expert witnesses. This could easily add another €1,000 to €2,000 to your expenses.

I think that in the picture, everyone will believe that was the mistake . You can see it here:

http://www.mikrocontroller.net/topic/162712

Lowest post.

Hab heute bei übelstem Schneeregen stundenlang dran rumgebaut. I have...
She repaired it and sealed it with self-fusing tape.
They put a thick rubber coat around it and arranged it in such a way that...
eigentlich garnicht mehr an die Schraube kommen kann. Cut it off or...
I didn't want to take her out yet, for the sake of providing evidence.

In total, there were 6 cables, and the twisted pair at the bottom is also defective.
It's not as obvious from the picture.

I find it almost miraculous that anything is still there.
it worked if you look at the connections that way. I guess that...
This is likely due to the fact that the screw was heavily corroded.
I'm also wondering how this could have appeared now, because it should have...
the wiring harness was located in a place where it absolutely shouldn't be moving.

With a bit of luck, we've now also found some mysterious and sporadic occurrences.
Problems I've always had (cruise control malfunction, car...).
Sometimes it doesn't start, and the electric mirrors don't work.
Brake pressure sensor error...

However, that's not immediately obvious. Besides the problem that...
Diagnose nicht ging und er nicht angesprungen ist. That was the...
gray/white wire, the W-lead between the instrument cluster and...
Engine control unit (ECU).

The two twisted black and green wires go to the mass airflow sensor as far as I can tell.
I see that. Maybe I got it replaced for free years ago.
when it seemed like it was broken? Or did it stop working as a result of the short circuit?
broken? But these things tend to break down all the time, so I guess...
"No problem." / "It's okay." / "Don't worry about it."

The green wire goes to the automatic transmission according to the wiring diagram, but I don't...
I had one, and therefore I was lucky... But that doesn't mean there wasn't a short circuit.
could also affect the control unit via the cable.
works.

Another green wire connects to terminal T10e/8 and terminates there.

The green/white wire connects to connector T10/2, and from there, it doesn't go anywhere.
weiter. Evtl. der Tempomat den ich erst nachgerüstet hab? What could...?
Can I still get one? / Are there any left?

The black/brown wire connects to the "relay for high heating power."
"This is only available on vehicles with manual transmissions, which includes my car as well."
Ob man das wohl merken würde wenn da ein Fehler wäre? Wwhat is going on there?
heated?

Now, the only question that remains is why the glow plug relay...
"It had been fluttering continuously and was supposed to be controlled by a purple/white wire."
werden, den ich aber in dem Kabelstrang nicht gesehen hab. So, either...
I must have missed it, or maybe the error is somewhere else.
That was strange because the fluttering occurred exactly in sync with the load.
The sound was similar to that of the motor, just like the buzzing noise you hear on a radio when using AM reception.
Let's see if I can finally get rid of this now...

Outsider wrote:

For evidentiary reasons (yet), I didn't want to cut them off or drill them out.

Just let it go. It's going to cost a lot of money, and in the end, you won't get anything because you can't prove anything.

Yes, I've also decided that I won't do anything like that. But still, I'll go there and talk to them about what they have to say, and maybe they'll voluntarily cover part of my costs or offer some other concession, such as doing a timing belt replacement where I only pay for the materials, or something similar...