Engine power drops at 3800 RPM: ARL

Hello specialists!

Since I got my Golf IV with the ARL engine, the power drops in 6th gear. The engine starts at approximately 3800 RPM, which prevents it from reaching its maximum speed (it's about 15 km/h short of the top speed).

The workshop checked the mass airflow sensor (MAF) and all possible engine parameters, but found nothing wrong.

So, I bought a VAGCOM device and logged the measuring blocks 8.9 and 11 (see link), as described in the troubleshooting section here on the page.

Unfortunately, I can't accurately interpret these values; are these values okay now, or not?

http://www.mark-steyding.homepage.t-online.de/2LOG-01-008-009-011.CSV

It would be really great if someone could help me.

Sure, here's the translation:

"Thank you in advance!"

Best regards,
Mark.

Okay, so 8 and 11 look good. "The turbo boost seems to be working well, and with regards to fuel injection, torque is always the limiting factor."

I don't understand why you logged MWB 9. It would have been better if it were a 3, but the fuel injection amount being controlled by air mass in the MWB 8 suggests that the air mass measurement is also working correctly.

The MWB 9 is also not suitable for performance measurement with KPower because it does not include speed data.

I'm not exactly sure about the ARL right now, but is this one chipped? Or is that a series production model that runs with 1.5 bar of boost pressure?

Regards,
Malte.

1.5 bar is standard .

hnsteyding wrote:

Are these values okay now, or not?!

Hi,

on the 1st. The view shows that all values are OK.
The boost pressure control ratio is slightly higher than what the software of other (similar) vehicles specifies. This could potentially indicate issues such as a partially clogged catalytic converter or vacuum leaks in the intake manifold.

To make more precise statements, we would need to have the dataset for your MSG (019 HH). It's possible that the actual values still align with the target values.

Hello Ulf!

The data set for my MSG is 038 906 019 HH.

Here's another Screenshot from VAGCOM:



@all

Thank you for your help!

My last ARL (presumably referring to a vehicle) was running at full throttle in 6th gear without interruption, according to [source/instrument]. The speedometer reads up to 215 km/h, but after a long run and on a straight road, it stopped at 235 km/h (3% speedometer deviation and NOT chipped; stock!).
It pulled continuously up to 4000 RPM and then became significantly "weaker."

My current car struggles to reach speeds of 200 to 210 km/h, according to [source/measurement]. Speedometer (8% speedometer deviation), then on a slightly downhill stretch to approximately 220 km/h; after 3800 RPM, there's virtually no more acceleration on a straight road.

It's particularly "bad" when you want to overtake someone on slight inclines (around 3-4%).
You get overtaken on the right by a Golf Variant at around 170-180 km/h.
So, there's probably something wrong somewhere else. http://www.mark-steyding.homepage.t-online.de/2MSG-Daten.JPG

What else I noticed:
In MWB 7, the values for the intake manifold air temperatures and the temperature of the air entering the turbocharger are listed (or are they?).

The displayed intake air temperature is always about 9-10°C higher (even with a cold engine) than the normal outside temperature; is this normal?

I'm quite at a loss; especially because, as far as I can tell, all the measurements are within the acceptable range (and my workshop was right).

Do you have any other ideas?

Best regards,
Mark.

Hello.

...hey, what tire and rim combination are you running?

Darius.

hnsteyding wrote:

It's particularly "bad" when you want to overtake someone on slight inclines (approximately 3-4%). You get overtaken on the right by a Golf Variant at around 170-180 km/h. So, there's probably something wrong somewhere else.

Hmm, maybe the camshaft timing isn't set correctly in relation to the crankshaft... there's a technical article about that here.
Fuel supply OK, filter within the replacement interval, no "bio-stuff" (biodiesel)?

Quote:

The displayed intake air temperature is always about 9-10°C higher (even with a cold engine) than the normal outside temperature; is this normal??

The LLT (field 3 in the MWB 7 form) varies with speed and LD. With prolonged operation, the temperature should drop to a few degrees above the ambient temperature. In the maximum power range, it is estimated that the temperature will be around 20 Kelvin above the ambient temperature, thanks to the large front-mounted intercooler.

If you're already logging the MWB 7 data, what does the fuel temperature (field 1) indicate?
It should be around 80°C in the maximum speed range.

Quote:

The dataset of my MSG is 038 906 019 HH

That is the part number, and it is also listed in the log.
I meant the complete software (i.e., what chip tuners modify), and that kind of thing can only be obtained from "specialized sources."

Hello Ulf!

I had the timing belt replaced about 5000 km ago, but it was already performing poorly before that.
In my last car service, I also had the problem that it took a very long time to "warm up"; after the timing belt replacement, it suddenly started running like a rocket (I guess the workshop finally set the correct timing)!

It didn't make any difference with my current car (and I don't think the workshop did a bad job; it was fine with my other car too).

I read the technical article about adjusting the camshaft; I'm too afraid to try it myself!!

Fuel supply is fine, the filter was changed about 10,000 km ago; no biodiesel!

I once logged MWB 7; maybe something will come of it.

http://www.mark-steyding.homepage.t-online.de/LOG-01-007-xxx-xxx.CSV

Well, in that case, I probably can't share my ARL dataset with you...


@DariusPolo

I have the standard tire size (195...).

hnsteyding wrote:

I had my timing belt replaced about 5000 km ago; however, it was already performing poorly before that. In my last car service, I also had the problem that it took a very long time to "warm up"; after the timing belt replacement, it suddenly started running like a rocket (I guess the workshop finally set the correct timing)! Only with my current car did it not work (I also don't think the workshop did a bad job; it was fine with the other car too).

Well, but apparently the Z-ratio or the Northwest setting was incorrect on the first one. "Wagen" is a sensitive topic.
Possibly, the workshop made a mistake on the first attempt. Made a "performance-enhancing misjudgment" .
(Something like that is probably possible; a relevant thread is linked in the article.)

Quote:

I once logged MWB 7; maybe something will come of it:

Well, a 007 without an MWB 11 is pretty useless because you can't see either the engine speed or the boost pressure. If you also reached the (reduced) maximum speed on the log, then it looks okay to me.


Since it's convenient right now, I'm putting your (slightly edited) logs in our new upload area, which everyone can use from now on.
Okay, I'm ready. Please provide the German text you want me to translate.

P.S.: I generally don't accept (additional) logs for "polishing" purposes; users need to handle that themselves. However, here's a technical article with relevant tips:
Okay, I'm ready. Please provide the German text you want me to translate.

Okay,
I have now logged MWB 7 and 11 together.

http://www.mark-steyding.homepage.t-online.de/LOG-01-007-011-xxx.xls

Is this all plausible?

P.S.:
I'm sorry, but I don't have any experience with Excel, so I wasn't able to create a chart.

hnsteyding wrote:

I have now logged MWB 7 and 11 together: Is this all plausible?

Overall, yes, but the outside temperature during the measurement is still missing from the data.

Unfortunately, the logs don't provide me with any real clues about the performance drop that occurs above 3800 rpm. It must therefore be a hardware issue, as mentioned above.

Hello Ulf!

The outside temperature was 17°C.

Well, I guess I'll just have to live with the "performance loss"; I'm too afraid to mess with the network settings.

Thank you very much for your help, both to you and to everyone else.

Best regards,

Mark.

It's not as complicated as it seems; it's also very well explained here in the forum.
But why don't you check the catalytic converter/exhaust system, as Ulf already suggested? If the exhaust flow is restricted, it can definitely cause the symptoms you described.
Does anyone know if there is significant variability in the results of the ARL (Arbeitsunfähigkeitsleistungen - sickness benefit payments) system, and if so, is it more likely to be skewed upwards or downwards?

I think it's likely to go up. At least, that's what I've heard so far. Mine had 330 Nm of torque and 170 horsepower at 100,000 km in its original condition, as measured by kpower and with "actual" weight (weighed and not estimated).

Best regards, Peer.

Zak1976 wrote:

It's not that much of a complicated process either; it's also very well described here in the forum. But why don't you check the catalytic converter/exhaust system, as Ulf already suggested? If the exhaust flow is restricted, it can definitely cause the symptoms you described. Does anyone know if there is significant variability in the results of ARL tests, and if so, is it more likely to be higher or lower?

Hello Zak1976!

I have now checked the NW settings on the engine: everything is okay. The article also mentions that the marking on the flywheel could be checked; I didn't do that. Is that still important?
The cat is also well-behaved; there's no meowing or clattering.

Well, it seems like this is a difficult case...


Best regards,
Mark.

hnsteyding wrote:

I have now checked the NW settings on the engine: everything is ok. The article also mentions that one could check the marking on the flywheel; I didn't do that; is that still important?

Um... the mark on the flywheel is used to bring the engine into the testing position (Top Dead Center), so shouldn't it also be checked?
Or did you determine the engine's top dead center (TDC) using the crankshaft position sensor (CKP) stop at the timing chain sprocket?