Lowering a Golf IV T...just springs or also dampers (35mm)?

Okay, I've been thinking about getting my TDI lowered because I find the suspension feels totally spongy. I don't want to go much deeper, just a slightly better road holding.
Is it enough to just replace the springs, or should I have a complete suspension system installed?
The shock absorbers have now accumulated 90,000 kilometers.
Of course, it's also a financial matter. There are opinions that say 'it's essential to replace them completely, because the dampers have settled into a specific range and could become leaky over time,' and others that say 'pfft, the standard shock absorbers are sufficient for 35mm.'
Please note that I'm not talking about any racing car qualities or faster cornering speeds, or that kind of nonsense.
Are there any experts here? Because I don't want to break anything on my Golf .
(by the way, I didn't choose that title at all! Where does that saying about ants come from?)

Hi Markus,

EDIT: This is a small joke from the forum software
I've corrected that.
Gremlin

Quote:

Please note, I'm not talking about any kind of racing car performance or faster cornering speeds or any such nonsense.

It's a shame, really, because many people only get them for the looks; safety and road handling often suffer as a result. I think braking distance and the speed at which you can safely enter a curve are extremely important.
And: Stiffness is not necessarily related to road feel. Many people might just weld flat iron instead of using proper SD (structural steel) profiles and then wonder why the vehicle bounces around corners like Herby (or even crashes into the next tree).

At 90,000 km, you should still consider replacing the shock absorbers. Even the original Golf 4's are too soft for my taste, and the shock absorbers will only get worse over time.
Don't make the same mistake I did with those cheap, low-quality shock absorbers. In my old Derby, the new ones were worn out after only 20,000 km, whereas the old ones were still going strong.
So, if you can afford it, get new shock absorbers (you can't go wrong with genuine VW parts; I unfortunately can't say anything about the long-term quality of brands like Fichtel, Sachs, Koni, etc.). Otherwise, it's better to leave the old ones in place than to ruin your suspension with cheap, low-quality parts.

Best regards, Rainer.

And: Stiffness initially has nothing to do with road handling. Many people might just weld flat iron instead of using proper SD (structural steel) profiles and then wonder why the vehicle bounces around corners like Herby (or even crashes into the next tree).


That's why I'm constantly bored and nearly falling asleep when driving behind those 'poser' cars with their lowered suspensions. And that's even though the lowered suspension isn't really suitable for proper, fast driving...

Here's the translation:

'By the way, is there a decent suspension system for an Octavia Combi WITHOUT lowering? I need every millimeter of ground clearance.'

CU Gremlin.

Gremlin wrote:

... Here's the translation: "By the way, is there a decent suspension system for an Octavia Combi WITHOUT lowering? I need every millimeter of ground clearance."

... I still have some VW Motorsport rally springs from a G1 lying around... The car is guaranteed to be 4cm higher with them... Is that enough for you?

A good coilover suspension system can be adjusted to the original ride height (http://www.hr-spezialfedern.de/index.php?inhalt=produkt-b&sprache=de).
In the worst-case scenario, you might have to resort to using an air suspension system (http://www.bavaria-tuning.de/shop.php?site=startseite).
The air suspension system can also be used effectively as a leveling system.

A good coilover suspension system can be adjusted to the original ride height.


Yes, but it can sometimes also limit the loading capacity of a station wagon, which Gremlin probably doesn't want. Otherwise, his ALH® will get too bored.


In the worst-case scenario, you might have to resort to using an air suspension system (http://www.bavaria-tuning.de/shop.php?site=startseite).
The air suspension system can also be used very well as a leveling device.

It's a better idea, but I would advise against using Bavaria products. I've heard of too many problems with leaks in their systems. Some people have already had trouble in the mornings, with their cars not being able to move because it was extremely low to the ground and scraping on the road even while stationary.

H&R will soon release a kit (H&aiR) that allows for stepless adjustment of lowering from 0 to 50mm. I hope for better quality.

Julian wrote:

That's a better idea, however, I would advise against using Bavaria products, as I've heard of too many leakage problems with that system. Some people have already been unable to get their cars moving in the morning because it was extremely low and was scraping on the ground while stationary.

Wow, he's so deep...

I'm sorry, but I am unable to access external websites, including the one you provided. Therefore, I cannot translate the text from the German website.

Is that also an address I know?

I have installed a Bilstein coilover suspension kit in my Golf 3. I'm very happy with it so far. No, the car isn't a show-off vehicle, despite the lowered suspension (yes, those things do exist).
However, comfort always suffers with deeper tire treads, to varying degrees depending on the tire model. Making something agile doesn't necessarily mean it becomes a car, and certainly not a cheap one. Furthermore, the most expensive components are often the ones that contribute the most to the appearance.

Generally speaking, I don't really like lowering cars with coil springs. In my opinion, nothing really works together anymore, and the standard shock absorbers aren't even matched to the springs.
There are also complete suspension systems from Sachs that offer a lowering of approximately 30mm. I would probably recommend something like that instead.

On the Bilstein website, there's a comparison tool. It compares the compression and rebound characteristics with the standard suspension of a Golf 4, for those who are interested.

Why should the allowable torque be minimized for a threaded connection?
I don't quite understand. In my case, no corrections were made to the entry.

A good suspension system can be adjusted to the original factory height .

only I'll have to pay a huge amount of money again for the 'thread' that I don't even want .

CU Gremlin.

markus78 wrote:

... because I find the suspension to be completely! too soft . I don't want to go much deeper, just a slightly better road holding. Is it enough to just replace the springs, or should I have a complete suspension system installed?

If it's really just about the handling on the road, then you definitely need to replace the shock absorbers. However, you could consider keeping the original springs. The original shock absorbers for the Golf IV are already quite soft, even when new. Therefore, I would recommend, for example, the yellow shock absorbers from Koni. These are available in the original length, and the stiffness is adjustable. This allows you to adjust the handling to your liking. I would recommend setting the Konis to their softest setting; that will already provide a noticeable improvement in road handling.

Furthermore, I would pay particular attention to the tire size and brand. By "tire size," I mainly refer to the sidewall height, not necessarily the width. For example, if you are currently using 195/65R15 tires, I would consider switching to something like 195/60R16 or even 195/50R17. While this involves changing the rims, it also significantly contributes to improved road handling.

Regards,
Guste.

'Just replacing the dampers? I haven't heard of that alternative before. But the springs alone don't cost that much either; the dampers are the expensive part. I'll start saving and look into Sachs options.'

I have 205/55 R16 tires, but I get the impression that my father has better traction with his Golf and its standard 195 tires.
Hi Markus,
... because I find the suspension feels completely! spongy . I don't want to go much deeper, just a slightly better road holding.
Is it enough to just replace the springs, or should I have a complete suspension system installed?

If it's really just about the handling on the road, then you definitely need to replace the shock absorbers. However, you could consider keeping the original springs. The original shock absorbers for the Golf IV are already quite soft, even when new. Therefore, I would recommend, for example, the yellow shock absorbers from Koni. These are available in the original length, and the stiffness is adjustable. This allows you to adjust the handling to your liking. I would recommend setting the Konis to their softest setting; that will already provide a noticeable improvement in road handling.

Furthermore, I would pay particular attention to the tire size and brand. By 'tire size,' I mainly refer to the sidewall height, not necessarily the width. For example, if you are currently using 195/65R15 tires, I would consider switching to something like 195/60R16 or even 195/50R17. While this involves changing the rims, it also significantly contributes to improved road handling.

Regards,
Guste

markus78 wrote:

Just replace the dampers? I haven't heard of that alternative yet.

Stiffer springs reduce body roll in corners, while stiffer dampers reduce rapid changes in body roll. It's usually the sudden changes in the road (e.g., transverse grooves/bumps in a curve, or the moose test) that put the vehicle in dangerous situations, not the constant angle of the vehicle.

So, when it comes to improving the handling of a car, I'm actually only familiar with dampers, not springs. But you're right about the price. If you're getting new shocks, then the price of the springs becomes irrelevant.

An alternative to buying new shocks is eBay (don't knock it!). Because some manufacturers (including Koni) offer a lifetime (or at least ten-year) warranty on their shocks. Therefore, you can safely buy them used. If they have noticeably deteriorated (which I haven't heard of with good brands), you can always have them reconditioned. I also bought mine used on eBay and am using it on the softest setting (Golf3). This is significantly better than the original, and still quite comfortable. (I already have enough back problems, so I don't need a suspension that's rock-hard.)

Regards,
Guste.

PS: What tire brand do you use, and what brand does your father use? Also, what is the rim diameter?

I personally recommend changing the individual feathers as well.
If you're looking for lowering springs, then Eibach or a comparable brand would be good, but definitely not H&R.

Based on my own experience with lowering suspensions using blank springs,
"A 520i, a 525i, a 318TDS compact. In all those cars, the car with the springs was always a little softer. In the A4, it was so soft that the original dampers bottomed out, so I replaced them with Koni Yellows, and now the driving experience is really amazing." Only comfort is now completely ruined.

I still think the K&W coilover suspension was the best thing I ever put on my 325i Coupe.
It was, in comparison, even a little bit softer than the Koni shocks in my A4, and therefore more comfortable.

Okay, so H&R isn't bad either. I know someone who has the 40/40 (something like that) installed, and their car is lowered by 35 mm. H&R's tax rates are not particularly high either.

Best regards, WarLord.