1,6 TDI kein Zweimassen-Schwungrad bei Start Stopp Funktion | Posts 16+

Hello Rainer,

That makes sense to me.

So, VW could have built the entire 1.6-liter engine series with EMS as well.

It would be great if it also works with EMS. It lasts longer.

AGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) and turbochargers are already bad enough when it comes to defects.

Thank you for the explanation.

Best regards,

BB

Thank you, Rainer, for the great explanation!
In a way, the ZMS (presumably referring to a specific component) still has its purpose, because crankshaft failures are indeed known to occur in 1.2 TDI engines. I've personally seen 3-4 instances of it in the forums.

Crankshaft failure.

Either it's a material defect, which shouldn't happen anymore today, or it's under-designed, which also shouldn't happen anymore.

Unless, of course, it's intentional, which is something I can very well imagine given the current management team.

Hello everyone!

In addition to Rainer's excellent explanation, I would like to add that a ZMS (Zweimassenschwungrad) becomes "stiff" starting at approximately 1,800 - 2,000 RPM. The torsional springs are increasingly activated by centrifugal force, and ultimately, at higher RPMs, it transitions to an EMS (Elektronische Motorsteuerung).

The ZMS is particularly pronounced below the aforementioned area. The speed(s) are also stressed, especially during startup.
I suspect that this was done intentionally, as idle speeds and times are rarely reached with start/stop systems, and the numerous starts would likely cause the ZMS (presumably a dual-mass flywheel) to fail before the warranty period expires.

Regarding the KW ratios, I don't think it's likely that they're caused by the missing ZMS (torque converter).
The uneven rotation of the crankshaft will occur regardless - with or without EMS. ZMS, but only the transmission and related components make the difference in terms of smoothness and refinement.

Best regards from Passau!

Actually, the division [of the system] shifts the resonance of the drive train (on the driven side) to lower frequencies. This means that the amplitude decreases more quickly, while the torsional vibration continues. However, if the torsion springs become completely stiff, it's a different situation, and the transmission effect reappears. Am I wrong about that?
hg
Herbert.

Hello everyone!

@HerBärt: That's completely correct, as far as it goes.
Only do the amplitudes of the "jolts" that need to be filtered decrease as the rotational speed increases, or these jolts become hardly noticeable and have little impact on the powertrain.

There used to be a nice technical document from LuK. Description for something that I unfortunately can't find at the moment.

Best regards from Passau!

I had read the description of LUK and was a little surprised. The (decoupling) function of the torsion springs, as in the previous clutch disc, should remain.
I would have expected that the change in torque depends only on the pressure change in the cylinder, and not on the rotational speed.
hg
Herbert.

The 1.6-liter engine seems to be more forgiving in terms of vibration, which is also reflected in the absence of balance shafts. It's possibly due to the nearly square design, which is rather uncommon in TDIs, and it only has an injection pressure of 1,600 bar.

"Along with the clearly cost-optimized design of this engine (with the omission of various..." Regarding the details of the derivation from the older relative 2.0, I believe the removal of the ZMS (presumably a specific component) is likely another cost-optimization measure implemented alongside the introduction of S/S (likely referring to Start/Stop technology), possibly to offset the higher costs associated with EFB/AGM batteries and a better starter motor.

Hello,

That would be fine with me.
I enjoy driving this car.
However, the distance should not be shorter than 30km, otherwise, especially in winter, it won't even get remotely warm.
Anything above 40 km is then okay.

I'm curious to see what the AGR (German Federal Cartel Office) will say about the software update.
"The turbo lag" / the engagement of the turbo has become a bit smoother and occurs earlier.

I personally don't notice the absence of the ZMS. The 1.6 Skoda felt identical with a new ZMS. The same goes for the 2.0 Passat. I have no idea how he would rap without a ZMS.
At least with the 1.6-liter engine, it doesn't make a difference.

For me, that means buying the BlueMotion wasn't necessarily the wrong decision.

The start-stop function is hardly ever used here. Therefore, potential wear and tear does not occur either.

"Thank you for the explanations, I'm just wondering why they didn't do it this way for all 1.6-liter engines."

Best regards,

BB