TDI: Warm up engine before driving!

Hi,
Is it harmful to let a PD TDI engine idle for 15 minutes in the morning before driving?

I understand that this is not done for ecological reasons, but I am only concerned about the engine here.
Can he do that?

Thank you very much.
Regards,
Sausage blinkers.

Okay, I couldn't even get my ALH engine to reach its operating temperature (for a timing check) even without the air conditioning running or any other electrical devices being used.

Or are you going to tell me that your PD (presumably referring to a specific device or system) also only gets lukewarm when idling?

Generally, idling is the least favorable operating condition for engines, especially for diesel engines.

btw: After 3 minutes of idling, the EGR system is deactivated, and then the temperature balance in the combustion chamber becomes really bad...

CU Gremlin.

Okay, letting a TDI engine warm up is nonsense! The best thing to do is to get in and drive off gently. It's obvious that you should let it warm up before you start accelerating hard.
If you let it warm up while it's stationary, that only means higher wear and tear .
... I think it even says in the instruction manual that you shouldn't let it warm up.

If you want to stay warm, you'll need to install a supplemental heater.

Tortsch.

My recommendation:

Search function - enter "Calix" and read the results...

"Warm-up" procedures are not ideal. However, pre-heating the engine with a heating element or portable heater is highly recommended. In Sweden, these heating elements (manufactured by CALIX) are almost standard equipment. Large parking areas (apartment buildings, company parking lots) even have electrical outlets for this purpose.

Not my car!
'My father has been doing this occasionally lately. He says the windows clear up quickly and the car gets nice and warm. I told him he should stop, but I didn't have any strong arguments against it, other than the environmental aspect!'
It's logical that the engine doesn't reach its full operating temperature like that!
But why is the wear higher than if I were to start driving immediately with a cold engine?
I understand that it warms up faster when in operation, but I'm wondering why it's gentler on the engine compared to warming it up slowly at 900 RPM.

Regards,
Sausage blinkers.

...why is it gentler than when it slowly warms up at 900 RPM?...

The warm-up phase takes significantly longer, and with a diesel engine, it's not really possible to warm it up while idling. After 15 minutes of driving, it would certainly have reached its operating temperature. The same amount of time idling doesn't result in any significant warming, and the cold start phase is unnecessarily prolonged. I once got stuck in traffic (for about 30 to 40 minutes) shortly after starting the car, at around -10 degrees Celsius, and even then, it (the ALH engine) didn't warm up at all.

The warm-up phase takes significantly longer, and with a diesel engine, it's not really possible to warm it up while idling anyway. After 15 minutes of driving, it would certainly have already reached its operating temperature. The same amount of time idling doesn't result in any significant warming, and the cold start phase is unnecessarily prolonged. I once got stuck in traffic (for about 30 to 40 minutes) shortly after starting, at around -10 degrees Celsius, and even then, it (ALH) didn't even get remotely warm.

If the engine is cold and running at 900 RPM, the piston travels a shorter distance compared to when it's cold and running at 2000 RPM. Therefore, shouldn't the wear and tear during that time be lower?
I can't tell you if the temperature gauge is moving, but after 15 minutes, all the windows are defrosted and the car is warm. I think the engine also has a built-in auxiliary heater, which helps the engine warm up faster!

My 1Z, on the other hand, takes a very long time to reach its operating temperature. However, I don't mind too much because the warm air starts coming out fairly quickly.

Sure, here is the translation of the text from German to English:

'So long'

This phrase is a common way to say goodbye in English. It is similar to the German phrase 'Auf Wiedersehen'.

Here are some other ways to say goodbye in English:

* Goodbye
* Bye
* See you later
* See you soon
* Have a good day
* Take care

I hope this helps!
Sausage blinkers.

Kannst auch ein Auto mit Standgas einfahren. Ne, jetzt mal im Ernst, warum man einen Motor nicht warmlaufen lassen sollte, wurden schon genannt (höherer Spritverbrauch, wird eh nicht warm (zu hoher Wirkungsgrad), die schädliche Warmlaufphase, wo sich noch nicht alles aufeinander eingespielt hat, dauert länger). Btw.: Ist dein Vater auch so unbelehrbar, was solche Dinge angeht? Meiner wollte selbst mal meinem Cousin einen Scheiss abkaufen, weil er was in Richtung KFZ Technik studiert. Btw.: Wenn der Kolben weniger Strecke zurücklegt, dann ist das nicht gut. Da hat er nicht volle Leistung. Deshalb soll es auch besser sein, wenn du deine Karre so einfährst: Einfach mal Öl etc. alles auf Betriebstemperatur kommen lassen, noch ein paar Kilometerchen fahren (am besten die Karre gleich bei VW in WOB abholen) und dann mal in den unteren Gängen richtig rannehmen (der Drehzahlmesser darf dann schon gen roter gehen). Da wird der Kurbeltrieb stärker gestreckt und der Kolben geht noch ein paar Millimeterchen weiter hoch (Sportpleuellagerschalen sind da auch zu empfehlen (mehr Spiel=Kolben geht noch weiter hoch im Zylinder)). Sollte man nur in den ersten drei Gängen machen (beim 6 Gang geht der vierte gerade noch so), da der Gegendruck noch nicht so stark ist. Dann wieder gemäßigt und dann wieder eine Spritze. Dann wieder gemäßigt und so weiter. Aber Achtung, der Motor sollte auf Temperatur sein. AnlThe following text is from another forum and seems reasonable to me.

Best regards, WarLord.

Hi,

Regarding the break-in period, there was also a longer thread about that here (which I started back then).

Here's a snippet from the previous thread: the claim about the extended rails at higher speeds is nonsense. "Millimeters" is already an exaggeration, but even in the micrometer range, there's nothing happening; the rotational speeds are far too low.

Please search the thread for the posts by diesel.gustav.

Best regards,

Jan.

Wurstblinker wrote:

When the cold engine is running at 900 RPM, the piston travels a shorter distance than when I drive it cold at 2000 RPM, so the wear and tear during that time should be less, right?

Hi Wurstblinker,

A running engine in a stationary car makes an infinite number of revolutions per kilometer, while a moving car does not .

WarLord wrote:

The instructions are from another forum and seem logical to me.

Not for me. Unless you have something against your car. Besides, not all forums have the quality of "Dieselschrauber."

WarLord wrote:

... The instructions are from another forum and seem logical to me.

This guide is designed to help identify potential weaknesses in a new engine, essentially to see "what problems might arise during the warranty period."

Racing engines do not have larger clearances in the connecting rod bearings. That's a myth.

"Real racing engines are broken in at low RPMs without much load. When my engine builder breaks in a new engine, he always takes it on the highway and drives behind trucks for kilometers. After 200 kilometers, an oil change is performed, and then the engine is run at full load for the first time. Only after approximately 500 kilometers of total driving is the engine subjected to its first event. These engines have often achieved significant mileage, despite extreme stress."
Racing engines can be quite delicate. For example, if slipper pistons are used, there's a risk of the pistons seizing in a cold state. Therefore, it's always recommended to warm up these engines properly before driving and not just let them idle. The reason is simple: a racing engine's thermal balance is designed for operation. Letting it idle can potentially cause heat buildup, which leads to uneven material expansion. This can damage the engine more than proper warm-up, where the engine cooling system can function effectively and ensure even heating.

I think the same applies to series motors.

The crankshaft drive is stretched more, and the piston moves a few more millimeters upwards (sport connecting rod bearings are also recommended in this case (more clearance = the piston moves even further up in the cylinder)).

Well, you certainly have some crazy ideas...

Let's think about what would probably happen if the connecting rod lengthened a few millimeters.
First, the HUB itself would not change.
Secondly, the piston would collide with the valves, because in order to achieve any overlap during the valve timing, recesses are already machined into the piston crowns.
Thirdly, the responsible engineer or iron founder would immediately be dismissed.

and the bearing shells have virtually no clearance because otherwise, they would rattle excessively and be destroyed in a very short time...
Typical storage times are in the single-digit µm range.



Furthermore, as Bertil mentioned, the engine is designed to operate at its operating temperature. This means that all clearances and tolerances are designed so that they reach their ideal values at operating temperature. For example, the pistons are oval when they are cold; only when the pistons and cylinders reach operating temperature is the shape perfectly matched. (Also, the cylinders are not perfectly round when the engine is cold).
And this temperature will never be reached when the engine is idling. Idling is the worst operating condition for an engine.
Engines that spend most of their time idling tend to fail more often than average.
The causes are deposits, oil dilution, and wear and tear.
Often, the first piston ring becomes carbonized, and when you suddenly demand power, it seizes and...makes a noise.

ergo: leave it on, fasten your seatbelt, start driving.

CU Gremlin.

Well, it's roughly in line with the opinion expressed in the other thread, and I haven't seen any arguments explaining why it's supposedly better to drive your car by strictly adhering to the rule of not exceeding 2,500 RPM and not accelerating.

Best regards, WarLord.

Thank you.
I think I have enough arguments to convince my dad that he's wrong. I don't think it's a good thing either.

On the other hand:
It's not his first car. He used to do things like that with his previous cars as well, and they all lasted for at least 300,000 kilometers. I now have his old Audi 80 TDI, and it's still running perfectly with almost 300,000 kilometers on the clock! And nothing has been done to the engine.
It's probably also because he doesn't allow himself to drive at full speed on the Autobahn.

Regards,
Sausage blinkers.