Spur einstellen! Ein paar Fragen! | Posts 16+

It's not dependent on the ESP (Electronic Stability Program), I have that too, and I can adjust the alignment tooth by tooth.

How do you properly align the wheels? I have this nagging feeling that mine aren't aligned correctly. After making sure the steering wheel is in the correct position on the column, I also need to check something else.

Best regards, WarLord.

Or what spatial geometric effects have I overlooked?

Ugh, how am I supposed to explain this...

The toothed rack is not aligned with the tie rod joints, but is located behind them and usually also higher. When you connect the joints, you form a trapezoid. If you now move the toothed rack, different angles are created on the left and right, meaning that the wheels are rotated by different amounts.

ah... Google is my friend, otherwise I would have had to reconnect the scanner .

CU Gremlin.

@Gremlin and Ulf

Very interesting, thank you very much .

I have been operating under false assumptions so far...

Gremlin wrote:

The toothed rack is not aligned with the line of the track rod joints, but is located behind it and also (usually) higher. When you connect the joints, you get a trapezoid. If you now move the toothed rack, different angles are created on the left and right, meaning that the wheels are also turned to different extents.

Ah yes, I think I understand .

Warlord wrote:

How do you actually properly align the tracking? I have this nagging feeling that it's not right on my car. After ensuring the steering wheel is in the correct position on the column, I also need to check something else.

Okay, I do it like this when necessary:

Turn the steering wheel fully to the right and then fully to the left.

1a. If the steering wheel can be rotated different distances to the right (R) and to the left (L), can the steering wheel be repositioned on the steering column so that it can be rotated the same distance from its straight-ahead position (regardless of the position of the wheels at that time) to its full lock in both directions?

2. Center the steering wheel precisely = turn the (new) desired straight-ahead position and, on a level surface (!), aim the rear tires past the outer edges of the front tires.
If the measurements differ for the rear tires or if they are taken at different distances from them, then I rotate the tie rod threads by the same angle (i.e., shortening one side and lengthening the other, without changing the toe-in or toe-out) } until the measurements on the right and left sides are equal.

3. If the vehicle now curves while the steering wheel is straight, a further fine adjustment is made according to principle 2.

It's not professional quality, but it's enough for my needs.
I've already practiced on about 5 cars, and so far, my tires haven't been wearing unevenly.

But there's still one thing I don't quite understand!

It is mentioned in relevant repair manuals that when installing new tie rods, both sides must be adjusted to 30.5mm on the inner side of the steering gear to achieve the center position!

Since I only replaced the tie rod ends, my question is: When I turn the tie rod, does that also change the value of 30.5mm?

Actually, no, because the rod is actually screwed firmly in place there, but what does that value even refer to then?

It's not professional quality, but it's enough for my needs.
I have already practiced on about 5 cars, and so far, my tires are not wearing unevenly.

'Hmm... maybe we shouldn't include this in the FAQ, as it might attract inexperienced drivers. While you might be paying attention to your toe angle/wheel alignment, it's quite an inaccurate method. 1-2° can make a difference, but you won't be able to detect that with the rear wheels. Neither sporty suspension nor driving at the limit are part of your driving profile, which is probably why it hasn't had much of an impact on tire wear so far. Older tires are also less sensitive because they are harder.'
You can adjust the wheels on the go-kart, which would be great!

by the way
With my A4, you can't really adjust the wheel alignment that easily, because the tie rods are located on top, almost at the height of the strut mounts. You need special tools for that... (Gremlin, your input: 'OE!')

Evening.
"Even better: wrap a string around all the wheels at the height of the axles, i.e., the center of the wheels, and then just start spinning them. That was my preferred method for my Lancia cars."

Best regards, Robert.

no wonder the Lancia cars never really took off .

'And how do you determine the geometric wheel alignment, and how do you adjust the front axle accordingly?'

CU Gremlin.

"Ah, that was sufficiently accurate using two aluminum rods. I positioned them at the back and took comparative measurements. Back then, I even made/milled custom pieces for the rim bead so I wouldn't have to measure directly on the tire."
From the spot, things got pretty , sometimes there were also oil cooler leaks, or even shattered clutch bells.

Best regards, Robert.

The steering angle difference is not perfectly accurate when the steering linkage is not perfectly centered, but that's a very minor geometric detail. If you imagine a solid tie rod, the steering angle difference is determined solely by the suspension arms and is therefore correct even when adjusted outside the center. However, because our tie rods are adjustable, the position where we define the center has a slight influence.

As mentioned in my thread about how tires tend to wear out on the inside of longer cars (/viewtopic.php?t=7281), a car with a longer wheelbase has a smaller steering axis inclination. The black line represents the steering angle of a car with a longer wheelbase, while the red line represents a shorter one. I haven't drawn the inner wheel in red, but everyone will recognize that it would have to turn even more than the black line. The outer wheel is always considered at 20°.

'Sorry, I only have Paint as a CAD system here at home...'

Martin L. wrote:

Sorry, I only have Paint as a CAD system here at home...

So what?
You can clearly understand what is meant, and that's what matters .

During a modern, computer-assisted surveying process, a specific step requires the steering wheel to be turned from its left stop to the center position, and then from the center position to its right stop. The program then registers whether...
The steering wheel position "center" corresponds to the mechanical center of the steering gear.

If that's not the case (assuming the tracking is already correct), for example, both tie rods must be adjusted by the same amount until the pushrod and the center of the steering wheel are aligned. The front axle is "steered straight," without the rack and pinion's toothed rack being moved (since it's already in the straight-ahead position). The tracking is not adjusted during this process (only temporarily).
Okay, so if you adjust both tie rods by the same amount (but in opposite directions) until the steering wheel is straight (during a test drive), you can't really go wrong. However, the alignment must be correct. And don't forget to secure everything properly.

"This issue only occurs in older vehicles (some Golf Mk2 models) that only have adjustment options on one side. However, unlike in modern cars, it's not a problem to rotate the steering wheel in these older models."

It is crucial to have precise symmetry in the steering geometry, especially when using special wheel and tire combinations (with wide tires), as there is a risk that one tire may rub due to the uneven steering angle on one side.

A tire service center that has the most modern equipment here (all wireless) charges 23 euros for the measurement without adjustment. They also install balancing weights on both the driver's and passenger's sides, which is often forgotten.