Fabia RS PD 170PS starker Leistungsverlust | Posts 32+

Could it be that this engine isn't getting enough air? Are the intake passages clear? Is the air filter okay?

The LLT (likely referring to a specific piece of equipment or system) can't possibly increase its temperature from 50°C to 90°C in just 6 seconds; something must be wrong.

Have you already cleaned the outer part of the wheel bearing assembly after removing the dust cover as described here?

Could you remove a fogger for testing purposes to improve the airflow to the LLK (low-level cooling)?

You mentioned that the EGR valve was replaced, or was it just cleaned?

mserge wrote:

The mass airflow sensor (LMM) doesn't detect when the load limit torque (LLT) increases; this happens "behind" it. Or am I wrong about that?

Yes, you are wrong.

When the turbocharger (with the same boost pressure) pumps hotter air into the engine, a smaller mass flow rate occurs due to its lower density.

2. All the air that flows through the engine is measured beforehand by the mass airflow sensor (MAF).

Combining points 1 and 2 results in: Hotter intake air equals a lower mass airflow sensor (MAF) value.

I apologize for not getting back to you sooner.
Job-dependent!

Okay, update the status.
Another visit to the workshop yielded no repairs, but a service was performed at 59,600 km.
The PD unit was not replaced, nor was the LLT sensor; only test drives were conducted at an outside temperature of 15 degrees Celsius , which allegedly resulted in an LLT reading of only 81 degrees and no loss of power.
Inquiry from the mechanic regarding boost pressure limitation due to high LLT (Load Limit Torque), but the diagnostic check using the engine control unit showed no issues with the Skoda.
There are no specifications or details, but there's another RS model at the workshop, also chipped by the same tuner, with 170 hp and 400 Nm , while mine is original without a chip .
Apparently, the Fabia RS is said to run perfectly with an LLT of 110 degrees and a boost pressure of 2500 mbar because a mechanic performed a comparative test drive.
I sent him my measurements via email, and I did another test drive today at 15 degrees Celsius, and the power loss is still noticeable even then.
Another visit to the workshop and a test drive in an outdoor temperature of 17 degrees Celsius, with a changed approach. I AM THE DRIVER . The mechanic is using his VAG tester.
First, I brought the engine temperature up to around 50 degrees Celsius by maintaining a constant speed of 3000-3500 RPM. Then, while driving uphill in 3rd gear, I accelerated from 1900 RPM to 4300 RPM, and surprisingly, the engine temperature reached almost 90 degrees Celsius, with a noticeable loss of power starting at around 3800-3900 RPM. This results in a maximum speed of approximately 110 km/h on a hill, as the boost pressure drops to around 1800 mbar. My previous Golf VR6 could easily reach 160 km/h.
The mechanic is sending my data and his data now and will let me know next week.
I hope Skoda will fix my problem before the first snowfall.
Free modifications like a ULF's POLO or maybe an EVO VIII radiator , or just a gift card for McDonald's, free ice cubes .

I immediately took the wheel arch liner off at home and had a look at the back of my intercooler, including a photo of the wheel arch and the inside of the intercooler, which seems to be fine. Also, here's a picture of the original front bumper from a Fabia RS (for those who aren't familiar with it). I'll have more tomorrow.
Once again, THANK YOU ULF for bringing light to the darkness with " The Clever Fox of Ulf ".

super7 wrote:

I then immediately removed the fender liner at home and took a look at the back of my air conditioning unit, including a photo of the wheel well and the interior of the AC unit, which seems to be fine.

If you're already scrutinizing the liquid cooling system out of desperation, why not take off the bumper cover as well?
Dann hältst Du eine Lampe hinter das Kühlnetz und versuchst, das Licht von vorne zu erkennen: Beim Blick genau im rechten Winkel ist ein sauberes Kühlnetz deutlich lichtdurchlässig, außer bei punktuell verbeulten Lamellen durch Steinschlag. Fliesimilar to each other.

Here's how to check the entire network area for larger dark spots -> these areas accumulate dirt that acts as a thermal insulator, hindering the airflow of cool air and increasing the LLT (lamp lumen depreciation). The reference point is the area of the network where the light shines brightest, likely in the upper right corner when viewed in the direction of travel. Ideally, an unused SMIC (Solid-State Micro IC) would be even better.

If the outer fins are partially blocked, try to verschandeln them as thoroughly as possible (use plenty of water and a long-bristled brush, a strong stream of water, possibly a steam cleaner, but be careful not to bend the fins!).
If you can't get it verschandeln anymore, don't waste any time and just buy a new SMIC.

Good luck...

Images of Fabia RS LLK / Front / Entrance to LLK.

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What are the dimensions of the entrance opening in centimeters? It looks quite small to me.
For comparison: on a Golf 4 with an ASZ engine, it's approximately 25 x 10 cm in size...

Okay, so the rectangular part is 14cm x 10cm, and the long slit at the bottom is 32cm x 1.5cm.
results in a total area of 188 square centimeters.
One-quarter less, so.

What I don't understand is why the car is only now experiencing such a significant loss of power.
Before, it at least ran somewhat smoothly, although with slightly reduced performance at 30 degrees Celsius.
At an outside temperature of 17 degrees Celsius, there is already a significant performance loss of 0.5 bar less boost pressure, which corresponds to approximately 90 horsepower.

If Skoda has a solution to my problem, I will definitely improve the LLK (likely referring to a specific system or product).
I'll leave it as is for now, until they figure out what's going on themselves.

What's surprising to me is that another chipped RS from the same tuner doesn't reduce the front lift during low-speed driving, even though it supposedly has a pressure of around 1.65 bar.
According to the mechanic, the exhaust gas temperature (EGT) rarely dropped below 100 degrees Celsius when going uphill, and there was no noticeable loss of power or smoking, but rather a significant amount of steam.

I don't even find it funny that Skoda itself doesn't know the maximum permissible load limit (LLT) before the engine control unit and turbocharger protection system activate and reduce the load.

I will find out next week what happens next.

A new control unit has already been tested experimentally, but whether it will be used is up to Skoda to decide.

Just get rid of the fog like Ulf does in the summer...

I find this topic very interesting because I also own a Fabia RS and plan to have it chipped soon.

Here's a quick question on the side. You had your car chipped to 170 horsepower, which means you don't have an *** chip. Consequently, you no longer have the factory warranty. And is it true that your workshop is actually replacing the turbo and other parts for you free of charge?

Otherwise, it's always said: "get tuned?" --> your problem!

"The original engine is back! Currently producing 131 horsepower and 310 Nm of torque."

My mechanic is also the one who tunes my car, so what are they trying to tell me? Are they saying it was a bad job?

They also offered me the same thing, but it was more expensive than what I got. I know a mechanic at a tuning shop, so I only paid for the software.

The problem isn't related to the tuning.

I would be interested in seeing your LLT (likely referring to diagnostic data). Do you happen to have a VAG-COM device?

skywalker wrote:

Here's another question, just a side note. You had the engine chipped to 170 horsepower. Therefore, you don't have an *** chip. Which in turn means you no longer have the factory warranty.

Even with ***, there is no more factory warranty .

First, I brought the engine temperature up to around 50 degrees Celsius by maintaining a constant speed of 3000-3500 RPM. Then, in third gear, I accelerated uphill from 1900 RPM to 4300 RPM, and I noticed that the engine temperature reached almost 90 degrees Celsius, with a noticeable loss of power starting at around 3800-3900 RPM. This results in a maximum speed of approximately 110 km/h when climbing a hill, which is limited by the pressure dropping to 1800-1900 mbar .


Hey, at a constant engine speed and therefore constant velocity, the internal torque decreases (unless you're driving uphill all the time), so the boost pressure should be reduced during that phase. Did you log or record the boost pressure during this recording?

So, I now believe that the NTC sensor might be faulty. Perhaps it has changed its characteristics due to aging or something else, and is showing a higher temperature than what is actually present. The engine control unit (ECU) believes this reading and is reducing the power output accordingly.

Okay, try verifying the intake air temperature that the control unit is seeing by using a second temperature sensor.

Perhaps, as Ulf once suggested, there's a rabbit in the pepper here.

Best regards, Jochen.

I initially started the low-temperature coolant (LLT) pump at a high speed ("2nd gear") and it wasn't registering any data. I then slightly increased it to about 50 degrees Celsius, as the outside temperatures were around 17 degrees, which is normally ideal for a turbocharger with an LLT system.

My intercooler problem seems to be getting less severe as the temperatures drop.
The device performs even worse when the outside temperature is between 25 and 30 degrees Celsius.

LOGFILE:
/viewtopic.php?t=13185

Changes and improvements made by me:

I've now increased the opening of the LLK (likely referring to a specific type of valve or aperture) all the way to the nebulizer, which has already made a significant difference.

I used a high-pressure washer with water at 110 degrees Celsius, maintaining a distance of 50 cm, and employed a very diluted cold cleaning solution as the cleaning agent.

Overall, the performance is noticeably better, but there are still temperature fluctuations from 3rd to 4th gear, reaching nearly 90 degrees Celsius, which the cooling system temporarily reduces for a few seconds.

The outside temperature was approximately 23 degrees Celsius.

I need to check with the workshop again today to see what they've found out and what should happen next.

I will not accept this problem.

If necessary, you can solder in a resistor to lower the temperature by 10-15 degrees, which should not damage the motor.

super7 wrote:

I have now increased the LLK opening all the way to the fogger, which has already made a significant difference. I used a high-pressure washer with water at 110 degrees Celsius, maintaining a distance of 50 cm, and employed a very diluted cold cleaning solution as the cleaning agent. Overall, the performance is noticeably better, but there are still temperature fluctuations from 3rd to 4th gear, reaching almost 90 degrees Celsius, which the cooling system temporarily reduces for a few seconds. The outside temperature was approximately 23 degrees.

Well, look, there's gradual progress happening...

Jochen145 wrote:

So, I now believe that the NTC is no longer functioning correctly. Perhaps it has changed its characteristics due to aging or something else, and it's showing a higher temperature than what is actually present. The MSG (Motor System Generator) believes it, and reduces the power accordingly. Okay, so try verifying the intake air temperature that the control unit sees by using a second temperature sensor.

That's definitely a sensible approach to tackling this persistent problem... but I would do it without any unnecessary tinkering -> simply replace the LD-LLT combination sensor as a test and then run another diagnostic log.

Where does your engine actually draw air from – through all those "trumpets," or from the engine compartment?

Best regards, Rainer.