Warnung: Biodieselfreigabe bei SEAT! | Posts 32+

Hi there,

It's always said that they're running out of money. The question is whether that's really true. It's a shame that we hear so little about the lawsuits being filed regarding this matter. It would be truly interesting to know how the judges view the situation.
I suspect that most people are simply intimidated by this huge corporation and are too afraid to file a lawsuit. There are, of course, precedent cases for this.

As for myself, I will continue to use biodiesel. Regarding the warranty, I have another question: If a new pump is installed within the warranty period, shouldn't a new 2-year warranty apply to that replacement part?
I recall reading in a flyer from the local dealer that all repairs are done with original parts, which naturally come with a 2-year warranty.
If the new pump fails again within this new 2-year period, shouldn't there be another one provided for free, or am I mistaken? This is aside from the issue of the approval process.

'@bonze: Perhaps standard purchase agreements will soon include a checkbox that says 'Vehicle operated with biodiesel? Yes/No.' This would allow buyers to avoid purchasing vehicles that have been run on biodiesel.
Perhaps it's a hidden defect for which the seller is liable. After all, by knowingly filling the tank with biodiesel, he laid the foundation for a potential defect.

Greetings.

Eike.

That's exactly what it is, Eike.
What can I, as the second owner, claim from the previous owner? He only did what was stated in the manual. I think judges will increasingly side with the manufacturers who approve biodiesel, because this product has been state-subsidized. It's likely that VW also received subsidies when they approved it back then. Primarily, you earned twice: once as a selling point and secondly by collecting subsidies?
With your warranty extension, I highly doubt that's the case.
Zu der neuen Norm: wer jetzt noch Biodiesel tankt und den Wagen verkauft, ohne darauf hinzuweisen könnte wenn ich drüber nachdenke wissentlich wie du schon sagtest, den Grundstein zu einen defekt legen. Versteckte Mängel könnte funzen weil VW den neuen BD für mein Fahrzeug z.B auch nicht freigibt! Ich glaube eher, dass der neue BD nach der neuen Norm besser ist als wie der Alte aber VW hat kalte Füße bekommen und die neue Norm kam denen nur gelegen! Könn'Test might even be right!!'
Regards:
Rainer (a frustrated buyer of a vehicle that had been run on biodiesel).

Edit: Here's an old study:

vera - 27.07.2001) Lässt sich mit Biodiesel wirklich sparen? Oder stimmt die Behauptung der Fahrzeughersteller, der alternative Kraftstoff würde die Einspritzpumpen schädigen? Mit einer stichprobenartigen Untersuchung bei 41 Tankstellen in ganz Deutschland wollte der ADAC jetzt herausfinden, wie es um die Qualität beim Biodiesel bestellt ist. Das Ergebnis dieser Momentaufnahme des Marktes war auf den ersten Blick alarmierend. Neun der untersuchten Tankstellen verkauften Kraftstoff, der nicht dem Normentwurf (DIN E 51606) entsprach, obwohl die Zapfsäulen damit ausgezeichnet waren. Allerdings: Die Abweichungen von der Norm waren nicht so schwer wiegend, dass sich die bekannten Folgeschäden eindeutig darauf zurückführen ließen. MöglTypically, the problems are...The tests also revealed another deficiency that the testers found in more than half of the samples: contrary to the requirements of the upcoming European standard, the oxidation stability was insufficient. In practice, this means that the fuel ages too quickly.

In six samples, the laboratory detected methyl esters of palm oil as additives. While this is not prohibited, it is still unacceptable. Because PME (methyl esters of palm oil) does not come from domestic production, this adulteration benefits neither German agriculture nor improves the product itself. Furthermore, the environment is additionally burdened by the long transport distances from East Asia.

Overall, the ADAC study could neither confirm nor dismiss the fears of many drivers regarding fuel derived from agricultural sources. Those who own a vehicle that has been approved by the manufacturer for this type of fuel will still need to decide whether the potential savings of up to 25 Pfennig per liter are worth the possible risk of engine damage. In this context, the ADAC is calling on vehicle manufacturers and biodiesel producers to quickly investigate and resolve the actual causes of the damage that has occurred to injection pumps.

Was ist passiert bis dahin? That was in 2001...
and not to be forgotten is this sentence: '...is worth the potential risk of engine damage.'
Try trading in your car, for example at a Ford dealership, and tell them that you've filled it with biodiesel. Just try it out and report back here what they say.

Hi there,

die Richter stehen aufgrund einer evtl. Subvention bestimmt nicht hinter den Herstellern. Wenn das so wäre, wäre es ein echter Skandal. In der Vergangenheit sind Richter eher dafür bekannt, daß sie die Rechte der Verbraucher schützen. Nicht umsonst hat sich die Qualität der Bedienungsanleitungen in den letzten Jahren entscheident verbessert. Die Hersteller wurden von den 'Richtern' quasi dazu gezwungen, weil diese den Verbrauchern die Fähigkeit abgesprochen hatten 'zwischen den Zeilen lesen' zu könen. SIf a car is not compatible with something, it must be clearly stated in the user manual in a way that even someone who isn't technically savvy can understand.

I didn't mean that installing a new pump under warranty automatically extends the overall warranty period. Rather, what I meant is that a new warranty is specifically provided for the replacement part and the work performed. If this replacement part fails again within the 'new' warranty period, the issue must be repaired under warranty once more.
This would mean that a new ESP (Electronic Stability Program) unit would be required if it failed within the 'new' warranty period. However, things might be different if the workshop were to simply reseal the leaking pump. In that case, the warranty would only cover the seal itself. If the pump leaks again shortly after (outside of the original warranty period), a new seal and its replacement would be covered under warranty. However, if something else within the pump is defective, you're out of luck and will have to pay for it.
What you're presenting as a study is just a report from the ADAC's automotive section. I know the text. The issue with palm oil and the associated transportation routes isn't pretty. On the other hand, crude oil is also shipped across the oceans over vast distances. And the additive in SHELL V-Power Diesel (GTL) comes entirely from Malaysia. In that sense, it's a tie. Furthermore, this GTL fuel is also made from fossil raw materials, which doesn't help with the greenhouse effect either.
Regarding the risks of an 'engine failure,' I am not aware of any specific cases. So far, all reported issues have been related to damage to the fuel injection pump.
From a housewife's perspective, everything under the bonnet is 'MOTOR.' In that sense, it's true. The articles in 'Motorwelt' are as profound as the journalism in 'Bild,' which means they have almost no substance. The magazine serves more for entertainment than for providing well-researched information. It's not surprising that I need hardly more than a quarter of an hour to read it, after which it goes straight into the trash.

What has happened since the report from 2001? Apparently, nothing significant. Otherwise, we would have definitely heard about it.

Alright then, take care and stay well.

Eike.

eike wrote:

..... The articles in "Motorwelt" are as profound as the journalism in "Bild." Their value is almost ZERO. The magazine serves more for entertainment than for providing well-founded information. It's no wonder that I need hardly more than a quarter of an hour to read it. Then, the magazine goes into the trash.

... for such a long time?
Often, the newspaper with the cheese advertisements ends up in the trash without being read.
I have long doubted the "technical expertise" of Germany's largest automobile club.

Best regards, a compulsory member of this association.

Dirk_S wrote:

for those who are still interested

What's interesting to me is that the individual SEAT dealerships probably interpret the standards differently... That could definitely lead to some amusing situations.

..... The articles in 'Motorwelt' are as profound as the journalism in 'Bild.' Their value is almost ZERO. The magazine serves more for entertainment than for providing well-founded information. It's no wonder that I need hardly more than a quarter of an hour to read it. Then, the magazine goes into the trash.


... for such a long time?
Often, the newspaper with the cheese advertisements ends up in the trash without being read.
I have long doubted the 'technical expertise' of Germany's largest automobile club.

Best regards, a compulsory member of this association.




Hi Bertil,
After all, I read some of it. For many, it's probably nothing more than a picture book...
Ich könnte auf das Blatt auch gut verzichten. Es ist halt einfach bei der Mitgliedschaft mit dabei. Letztere hat sich für mich schon deutlich gerechnet, da ich bzw. meine Frau schon Pannen hatten, die sonst deutlich teurer geworden wären (incl. Er(sentence vehicle).

Greetings.

Eike.

Hi there,

Hi,

It's always said that they're running out of money. The question is whether that's really true. It's a shame that we hear so little about the lawsuits being filed regarding this matter. It would be truly interesting to know how the judges view the situation.
I suspect that most people are simply intimidated by this huge corporation and are afraid to file a lawsuit. There are corresponding precedent cases, though.

As for myself, I will continue to use biodiesel. Regarding the warranty, I have another question: If a new pump is installed within the warranty period, shouldn't a new 2-year warranty apply to that replacement part?
I remember reading in a flyer from the local dealer that all repairs are done with original parts, which of course come with a 2-year warranty.


It kind of seems like you're mixing up 'warranty' and 'guarantee.'

Warranty is not the same as guarantee!

'You're right, there is a clear difference. VW only offers a 6-month warranty (legally required), and then an additional 1.5 years of legal guarantee.'
Als meine Pumpe nach 23 Monaten wegen BD leckte wurde sie trotzdem laut Werkstatt auf Garantie bzw Gewährleistung getauscht. Hätten sie vielleicht nicht machen müssen, weil Gewährleistung nur Produktionsfehler umschließt. Da geht die Streiterei dann wieder loß, ob die Verarbeitung nicht BD-fester Dichtungen ein Produktionsfehler ist. Meiner Meinung nach ja, da die angepriesenen Produkteigenschaften (BD-tauglich lt. Pr...if the GDPR and BDA regulations were not followed.

Greetings.

Eike.

eike wrote:

VW only offers a 6-month warranty (legally required) and then an additional 1.5 years of guarantee (also legally required).

According to the law, the term "guarantee" does not actually exist!
"Guarantees" are voluntary services that go beyond the statutory warranty.

.....VW only offers a 6-month warranty (legally required) and then an additional 1.5 years of guarantee (also legally required).


According to the law, the term 'guarantee' does not actually exist!
'Guarantees' are voluntary services that go beyond the statutory warranty.

Hm, this is new to me. As far as I know, the transition between warranty and guarantee is where the burden of proof shifts. In theory, the manufacturer should have up to 6 months to prove that a defect is not a manufacturing error, and then the buyer has to prove that it is.
Is there no lawyer here who could quickly clarify the matter?

Greetings.

Eike.

Slightly off-topic.
VW does not offer a warranty for a car purchased from a German dealer.
The manufacturer's warranty covers more than this; it's purely a matter between the dealer and the customer.
For vehicles sold abroad (including those re-imported), the following regulations generally still apply:
the Volkswagen factory warranty.

Best regards, Ide.