Timing correct, but timing belt incorrectly installed?

Hi everyone,

I'm still trying to figure out the performance loss, and I'm starting to get really frustrated. I've already created several threads and checked everything that's been suggested, but nothing seems to be wrong. I've run the standard logs, and there's nothing obvious! However, I'm still only getting around 100 horsepower (approximately 8 seconds) with the DZR. Something must be wrong.

My latest thought is that the timing belt might be misaligned. I bought the car with 120,000 km on it, and it's never run perfectly. The sound is also not as good as my old 1Z.

There's a significant lack of torque in the engine, even with enough LD and LM.

Is it possible that the timing belt is incorrectly installed, but the engine timing (fuel injection start) is still correct?

Best regards,
Reuselkopp

P.S.: Maybe I'll take advantage of Rainer's offer, if he still has it, and have a skilled professional mechanic work on my Golf.

Hi Reuselkopp,

Zitat:

P.S.: Maybe I'll take Rainer's offer, if he still has it, and have a professional mechanic work on my Golf.

Sorry, I don't do troubleshooting or repairs. I'm constantly getting requests for this, and now people are even standing outside my door :?

To be perfectly clear: anyone who hires an engineer for troubleshooting should be able to afford to pay them accordingly.

Unfortunately, I am constantly contacted by people via phone, private message (completely overwhelming), shop contact form, and now even at my doorstep, who expect me to troubleshoot their car's issues for a small donation or "just a quick" (i.e., approximately one day) job.

Anyone who needs the appropriate tools for troubleshooting can access the Diagnosis and Tuning Online Shop and there is definitely plenty of helpful information for troubleshooting available for free in the forum.

In the short term, a list of workshops is planned, in which both independent and brand-affiliated workshops can register for free. I will moderate this list and try to keep it at a usable level. That is, anyone who is frequently found to be engaging in customer scams or performing unnecessary repairs will simply be removed.

Then, anyone who has a problem can choose a workshop nearby.

Regards, Rainer

The fuel injectors may be correct, but it is also possible that the camshaft and crankshaft do not align. Is this the most common problem when the timing belt has been incorrectly replaced?

reuselkopp hat folgendes geschrieben:

Is it possible that the timing belt is incorrectly installed, but the engine timing (injection start) is still correct?

Maybe:
The injection start (pump ground setting) and engine timing are set independently.
It is therefore entirely possible that only your valve timing is incorrect. This can significantly change the engine's power characteristics (even before the pistons and valves meet).

No: this cannot be tested with VAGCOM, but instead, the NW-Line is used.

Oops, bastion was 1 minute faster

@Rainer
Hi, have you offered this service before? I mean, I think I read somewhere that someone was offering troubleshooting for 75€. Just the troubleshooting, not the repair. Basically, going somewhere to have it checked out, then getting told what it probably is, and then going home and fixing it yourself.

@everyone

Ah, so it's definitely possible that the timing belt was damaged during the last replacement. The next timing belt replacement is due soon anyway. Hopefully, if it really is a misadjustment, I haven't caused any damage. Having almost 90,000 km with a misaligned timing belt is quite a lot.

I basically need to check if the gearbox grooves, camshaft (with a ruler-sized tool), and ESP with locking pin are aligned?

What I don't understand is that when my VW Golf had 120,000 km on it, they installed a new ESP unit. Shouldn't that have been noticeable?

reuselkopp hat folgendes geschrieben:

I actually just need to check if the gearbox has a KW slot, the camshaft (with a ruler replacement), and the ESP with a locking pin in the OT are aligned.

Yes.

Zitat:

What I don't understand is that VW Fuzzis installed a new ESP at 120,000 km. Shouldn't that have been noticeable?

If they didn't take a closer look at the camshaft (or didn't have a camshaft ruler at hand): IMO, no.

If they didn't check this during the ESP replacement, I'd send the entire operation to waste...

From a technical standpoint, you have to loosen the timing belt to remove the ESP... If they simply re-tighten it without checking, I don't understand how they can do that... But just check it yourself! Remove the valve cover, rotate one at the lower end of the suspension, and once the marking on the transmission is correct, insert a wide piece of metal into the input shaft. If it's a problem, you should be able to see it immediately!

If you've checked the fuel injection timing with VAGCOM and TDI-Graph and everything seems to be working correctly, then the mechanic couldn't have made a mistake. Even a slightly adjusted camshaft won't cause any performance loss or engine damage.

Best regards!

I can only write what I know from AFN TDI, and for checking the camshaft timing, you have to remove the valve cover from the engine. I don't know if you're willing to do that.

However, if performance is already being affected, a strange engine noise (loud, rattling, uneven) should also be noticeable. When the tensioner belt on my timing chain stopped working, the engine was still running smoothly, but produced almost no power. It was also overheating and making a very loud, rattling noise due to the incorrect timing. It sounded almost as if there was no oil in it.

Hi,
to be honest, it's not that much work to just remove the cap. I don't really have an uneven engine running. But the engine does sound a bit strange. It feels very soft in the LL, and when I give it some power, it feels strange, and I can feel the engine vibrating in the front, but it's not transferring the power to the road. The RPM is increasing, but the perceived speed is not. There's absolutely no typical TDI "thud" feeling. When I compare my AFN to a 2.0DTI from Opel Astra, which has the same torque (235nm), my AFN feels like a weak and outdated engine. Even after the popometer, my 1Z had much more power from the bottom! Something is definitely wrong, and I haven't found anything since 57,000km.

Okay, so, you're looking for a performance loss, but all the values you're getting with VAG-COM seem correct. Maybe you should think about the things that should be checked first before starting a systematic troubleshooting process with VAG-COM (see FA). If even those things can be ruled out (e.g., catalytic converter, fuel tank filter, etc.), then you're left with no choice but to check the timing. Additionally, you could also perform a compression test.

What surprises me is that you have a VNT17. Your AFN doesn't have this turbo, does it? So why is it on there? If you're running at standard performance and standard boost pressure, then the original turbo should be used. If nothing else helps, then I'd just stick with the original...

I've had the car for almost 2 years and I think I've checked everything, except the timing belt and gearbox! I've also checked things like the fuel filter, etc. The fuel filter is clear and the fuel line is unobstructed. I had a problem with air bubbles, so I replaced the original fuel line with a complete PA (polypropylene) line. I've also replaced the air mass sensor, pressure sensor, vacuum pump, fuel injectors, and the entire vacuum hose. The EGR valve has been disabled. The intake manifold has been cleaned. I replaced the turbocharger because the boost pressure was not correct when I first had the car (a small turbocharger was causing a problem). But I don't think the VNT17 is the problem, because the boost pressure is good. There are very few overboosts, and I reach full boost at 1800 rpm.

Have you checked if the fuel injection amount is correct under full load? If the engine isn't smoking and the boost pressure is present, then too little fuel can only be caused by not enough fuel being injected. Without fuel, even the best horse can't give birth. You just have to figure out why there isn't enough fuel going into the engine. Otherwise, you really should measure the compression.

The injection quantity under full load is approximately 42mg/H. The torque limit always has the lowest value.

I would also rule out high compression, as the engine starts up perfectly cold, with no unusual noises or anything. However, it takes a little longer than usual when warm, but still under 1 second, which is typical for AFN engines.

42mg/H ... hrm. I'm not entirely sure, but shouldn't that be 51mg/H?

According to the sales data list, it's 40-45 mg/H. But I've also seen figures around 50 before. But that one was probably modified.

:roll: I'm confused! I just looked again, but the sales data list doesn't have anything for AFN.

:?: But what should the sales injection amount be in mg/H? I definitely used a maximum of 42 mg/H. Could it be a software problem or an ESP problem???