Clutch slipping after chip tuning (90hp) on a VW Golf IV ALH

Hallo Kollegen, vielleicht kann mir jemand einen Kupplungs Tipp geben. Habe einen Golf IV, TDI, ALH den ich seit 40000km chipgetunt fahre. Bin mit dem Auto auch sehr schonend umgegangen. Eingebaut ist ein Zusatzsteuergerät (Airtronic D-Chip) von Zemotex. Bin damit absolut zufrieden, geringer Verbrauch, kein Ruckeln oder Rauchen, sehr gutes Drehmoment . Aber: Leider rutscht die Kupplung jetzt bei im Bereich von 2000-2800 1/min beim starken Beschleunigen durch. Wenn ich den Chip abschalte, gibt es dieses Problem nicht mehr. Nun suche ich nach einer verstärkten Kupplung, die hier auch passt! Kann mir da jemand einen Tipp geben, oder hat jemand eine ähnliche Erfahrung gemacht? WI would appreciate a .'Recommendation appreciated. I actually wanted to install the clutch from the 115 HP AJM pump-injector engine, but it's operated by a hydraulic release bearing and probably won't fit for that reason. [/b]'

Get a sports clutch from Sachs Racing. They have one that fits the ALH engine perfectly. The one for the AJM is larger, but it doesn't offer much benefit either. It only handles 350 Nm of torque, while the ALH clutch handles 250 Nm. As far as I know, the Sachs clutch can handle around 400 Nm.

A recommended dealer for Sachs parts is the Henning GmbH in Essen. Do a Google search; I don't recall the address at the moment.

Hi,

Quote:

Get a sports clutch from Sachs Racing. It's available specifically for the ALH engine. The one for the AJM is larger, but it doesn't offer much benefit either. It only handles 350 Nm, while the ALH version handles 250 Nm. As far as I know, the Sachs clutch can handle around 400 Nm.

I would strongly advise against using a sports clutch.
These things are developed for the racetrack and, if I may borrow words from a forum member, they are "digital" clutches. That means they only know "on" and "off."

A sports clutch lacks torsional springs and usually has sintered metal friction linings. The absence of torsional springs causes the clutch to engage immediately. The damping effect normally provided by springs is absent. This characteristic, combined with these linings, results in a clutch that is completely unsuitable for normal road use.

If you let the clutch slip slightly when driving in the city or in traffic jams, which is often unavoidable, these pads heat up very quickly and can literally burn out.
Mine only lasted about 30,000 km like that.
In addition to that, every time the clutch is engaged, there's a jolt that runs through the entire drivetrain.

I would recommend a "reinforced" clutch instead.
For example, the G60 clutch served me well. Fichtel & Sachs also offers a so-called "Power Clutch." If you really want to push things further, you can also get a reinforced clutch (with double/stronger torsion springs and stronger spring force of the pressure plate) from Sachs. These can handle up to 470 Nm and cost around 480 euros (excluding the release bearing).

In addition, all TDI models should have a hydraulic clutch.

Please correct me if I'm wrong anywhere.

Greetings.
Thomas.

Thomas wrote:

... A sports clutch has neither torsion springs nor, in most cases, sintered metal linings. The absence of torsion springs causes the clutch to "engage" immediately. The damping effect of the usual springs is absent. This characteristic, combined with these linings, results in a clutch that is absolutely unsuitable for normal road use.

Sachs offers sport clutches with and without torsional springs. For Group G vehicles (standard production), only standard clutches are allowed. However, it is permissible to install a sport clutch of similar design – i.e., one with torsional springs. These clutches can also be painted quite well. It does require some getting used to.
Clutch problems are usually not caused by the clutch disc itself, but rather by the pressure plate.

Hi,

Quote:

Sachs offers sport clutches with and without torsional springs.

Do torsionally sprung clutches also fall under the term "sports clutch"?

Quote:

Clutch problems are usually not a problem with the disc itself, but rather with the pressure plate.

Yes, that's correct. I listed them as well. However, there are also versions with stronger springs.

Greetings.
Thomas.

@Thomas:

There are also other options besides sintered metal couplings...

The clutch, sized for an ALH engine, can handle approximately 800 Nm of torque when made with sintered metal. However, the ALH engine doesn't produce that much power. I probably wasn't very clear about that earlier. I wouldn't have recommended that particular clutch.

Sachs sports clutches are designed for production vehicles and have a slightly higher friction coefficient. They look almost identical to standard clutches.

The 1A models are mobile, but they require more force to engage and therefore have a higher closing force. The ones from LUK sometimes suffer from this issue.

Thomas wrote:

Hi, Do torsionally sprung clutches also fall under the term "sports clutch"?

Yes!

Quote from Thomas:
In addition, all TDI models should have a hydraulic clutch.

Please correct me if I'm wrong anywhere.

Greetings.
ThomasAnswer from Chrissi:
All TDI engines have a hydraulically actuated clutch. The only difference is that the pump nozzle no longer has an external slave cylinder on the transmission, but instead, the hydraulic component is integrated into the release bearing, which is located in the clutch bell!

chrissi wrote:

Hallo Kollegen, vielleicht kann mir jemand einen Kupplungs Tipp geben. Habe einen Golf IV, TDI, ALH den ich seit 40000km chipgetunt fahre. Bin mit dem Auto auch sehr schonend umgegangen. Eingebaut ist ein Zusatzsteuergerät (Airtronic D-Chip) von Zemotex. Bin damit absolut zufrieden, geringer Verbrauch, kein Ruckeln oder Rauchen, sehr gutes Drehmoment . Aber: Leider rutscht die Kupplung jetzt bei im Bereich von 2000-2800 1/min beim starken Beschleunigen durch. Wenn ich den Chip abschalte, gibt es dieses Problem nicht mehr. Nun suche ich nach einer verstärkten Kupplung, die hier auch passt! Kann mir da jemand einen Tipp geben, oder hat jemand eine ähnliche Erfahrung gemacht? WI would appreciate it if you could...Recommendation welcome. I actually wanted to install the clutch from the 115 hp AJM pump-injector engine, but it is operated by a hydraulic release bearing and probably doesn't fit for that reason. [/b]

Hello Chrissi,

das gleiche Problem hatte ich bei meinem AJM 115(140 Chip) PS PD-TDI. Nach ca 20tkm Tuning rutschte die Kupplung je nach Wetter (nicht immer) beim stärkeren Beschleunigen!!! Letztendlich mußte ich irgendwann den LMM tauschen(Typische Syntome: kein Durchzug, keine Endgeschwindigkeit,.....). Jetzt nicht Lachen, seitdem geht die Kiste wie die SAU aber die Kupplung rutscht nicht mehr!!! Vielleicht gibt dein LMM falsche Werte aus, wie bei meiner Möhre!!! Leih dir doch mal einen funktionierenden LMM bei einem Bekannten aus und mach mal ne Probefahrt damit!!! The LMM might not be a bargain, but it's still cheaper than a new clutch!

Best regards,


Frank.

Hello Frankie,

The effect you identified can simply be ruled out.
Even if the 'faulty' HFM (honeycomb flow meter) measured too much torque in the range of maximum torque and too little in other speed ranges, it would not meet the specifications. In that case, power would definitely be wasted compared to a functioning LMM (lambda measuring module).

A clutch can only transmit a certain maximum torque before it starts to slip. Therefore, if the clutch is no longer slipping, the engine is delivering less power at that specific RPM than it was previously.
I would classify it as "coincidence."

Best regards, Rainer.

Rainer K. wrote:

Hello Frankie, The effect you identified can simply be ruled out. Even if the 'faulty' HFM (honeycomb flow meter) measured too much in the area of maximum torque and too little in other speed ranges, it would not meet the specifications. In that case, power would definitely be wasted compared to a functioning LMM (lambda measuring module). A clutch can only transmit a certain maximum torque before it starts to slip. Therefore, if the clutch is no longer slipping, the engine is delivering less power at that specific RPM than it was previously. I would classify it as "coincidence." Greetings, Rainer

.


Hello Rainer,

der Kupplungsrutscheffekt trat bei mir mit ca. 48tkm auf. Bin dann bis ca.85tkm mit sehr viel Gefühl gefahren. Dann gabs Probl. mit verzögerter Gasannahme --> AGR-stillgelegt, danach lief die Kiste wieder wie vorher. Kupplung rutschte wieder bis ich dann bei 106tkm zum neuen LMM greifen mußte. Seitdem läuft die Kiste super ohne Kupplungsrutschen bis heute 122Tkm.Die AGR ist immer noch abgeklemmt. Und interessant ist, mit dem def. LMM war der Durchzug bescheiden und Endgeschwindigkeit erreichte ich nur noch im Windschatten oder im Gefälle, aber an manchen Tagen rutschte die Kupplung immer noch knapp über 2000 U/min!!! SIt's strange, but that's just how it is!

Best regards,

Frank.

Hi,

Perhaps some liquid got onto the clutch back then, which has since thinned out over time? It's possible for something to get in through the inspection hole for the TDC (Top Dead Center) mark.
Perhaps it's just the seal on your transmission shaft that is leaking, and the gearbox is now without oil.

Best regards, Rainer.

Quote from Frankie:
After approximately 20,000 km of modifications, the clutch would slip depending on the weather (not always) during harder acceleration! Eventually, I had to replace the mass airflow sensor (typical symptoms: lack of power, no top speed, etc.). Now, don't laugh, but since then, the car runs like a beast, and the clutch doesn't slip anymore.


Answer:
The LMM is only a few months old, and perhaps that's why the car is running particularly well.
I would have to install a faulty MAF sensor in order to reduce the performance again!
I can confirm that the clutch slippage is weather-dependent; as you know, the TDI engine performs particularly well in cool weather and generates corresponding torque. I definitely need the reinforced clutch, but I'm still waiting for a real recommendation!

Quote from Frankie:
Wait, but I'm still waiting for a real recommendation!

You might have to wait a long time, as there's already enough information in this thread. It's more or less correct, although the 'less' outweighs the 'more.'

Quote from Chrissi:
Wait, but I'm still waiting for a real recommendation!

You might be waiting a long time for that...

Comment from Chrissi about it :
You're right, Julian. I find all the posts interesting, but I would still be happy if another ALH (or AHF) driver contacted us who has experienced this problem themselves and has installed the reinforced clutch from Sachs that you recommended. I am also interested in the price and so on...