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Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown

 
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dieselmartin
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Post11-09-2007, 14:19    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

Hi.

I've been wondering for a long time what Mercedes was thinking when they "invented" the A- and B-class cross-member suspension.

A Ph.D. student in mechanical engineering once mentioned that this bend in the control arm represents a significant weak point.

And is that stuff only for the exhaust pipe?



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Transparency, Teamwork
... there was another T.

I don't know what the f*ck it was.


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Roger
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Post11-09-2007, 14:31    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: A Car's Limits Quote

dieselmartin wrote:
And the quark is only for the exhaust pipe???

... which, in turn, is also feeling down icon_rolleyes.gif ...
Gruß
Roger

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//images.spritmonitor.de/880099.png


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ulf
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Post11-09-2007, 14:35    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: A Car's Limits Quote

dieselmartin wrote:
And the catalytic converter only for the exhaust pipe???
No, also active pedestrian protection: If a fellow citizen, in the free expression of their personality, steps in front of the bicycle, it folds away - and the person doesn't break their foot icon_razz.gif.
Gruß Ulf
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dieselmartin
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Post11-09-2007, 14:50    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

If it's even *THE* control arm.

The part ends in a rotating element that could steer the rear wheels in a mirror-symmetric fashion. So, if one wheel steers to the right (due to external forces), the other would steer to the left.

It's quite strange that...



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Transparency, Teamwork
... there was another T.

I don't know what the f*ck it was.


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matthiasTDI96
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Post11-09-2007, 15:01    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

Well, then the response was:

...parabolic axle with a selective damping system...

We can see what's behind that term in the photo, and it would certainly be interesting to see how it works technically. The fact is, this thing drives really well...


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dieselmartin
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Post11-09-2007, 15:08    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

Okay.

I'm just a drone (hey? I can't, I'm just one of them), and I'm looking under the skirts of every A- and B-class student.

m;
Transparency, Teamwork
... there was another T.

I don't know what the f*ck it was.


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dieselmartin
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Post13-09-2007, 8:38    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

The parts are not the control arms.

Those are indeed tie rods, as the B-Class has a multi-link rear axle.

I just took some pictures.



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Transparency, Teamwork
... there was another T.

I don't know what the f*ck it was.


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teileklaus
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Post13-09-2007, 11:11    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: A Car's Limits Quote

Roger wrote:
dieselmartin wrote:
And the quark is only for the exhaust pipe???

... which, in turn, is also disappointed icon_rolleyes.gif ...
.
Crushed tailpipe: Rear impact! Engine protection? icon_cool.gif
Gruß, der Teileklaus
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Post13-09-2007, 12:01    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: A Car's Limits Quote

teileklaus wrote:
Roger wrote:
dieselmartin wrote:
And the quark is only for the exhaust pipe???

... which, in turn, is also disappointed icon_rolleyes.gif ...
.
Crushed tailpipe: Rear impact! Engine protection? icon_cool.gif

Or something like that icon_cool.gif.
I just wanted to say that the probability of the bend having little to do with the end of the pipe, because it could have been bent in a different location.
Gruß
Roger

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//images.spritmonitor.de/880099.png


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teileklaus
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Post13-09-2007, 12:50    Subject: Kickboxing: Training, Techniques & Benefits Quote

I believe the steering system offers the possibility that the rear wheel on the outside of the turn contributes more to the lateral force by being steered inwards from the outside (where the higher force is acting).
- Now comes the exciting part.
The effectiveness of the design increases as the load at the rear becomes greater.
and oversteer is reduced by "steering" the rear wheels as well.
As far as my technical understanding of the matter goes icon_cool.gif.
Gruß, der Teileklaus
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Post14-09-2007, 8:38    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

The A-Class has the same construction (just more nicely disguised icon_wink.gif).



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Transparency, Teamwork
... there was another T.

I don't know what the f*ck it was.


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matthiasTDI96
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Post14-09-2007, 9:23    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

I understood it like this: Is the B-Class a high-priced version of the A-Class? Then it's clear that they are related under the sheet metal!


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Post16-09-2007, 0:12    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

This construction is strange, and it looks quite cheap icon_rolleyes.gif. I'd rather have an old, robust W123 icon_cool.gif.
NA,Gehörlose wie ich können auch Schrauben! Ihr HÖRT ich FÜHLE! T3 TD EX-JX Jetzt 1Z mit 122PS und Renaultgetriebe Golf II TD Bj 84 512Tkm Passi 35I 1Z 468Tkm--> Seat Toledo AHF-- Toledo ARL 477Tkm mit Spritspartuning icon_wink.gif 99er T4 Syncro-Cross 100800km grad eingefahren


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Post21-09-2007, 9:19    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

I'd like to contribute something briefly as well...

Whether it's a weak point or not, the parts are recalculated using FEM (Finite Element Method) in Catia or elsewhere during the design process, and designed to withstand the usual operating loads; at least, theoretically. icon_wink.gif


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Post21-09-2007, 9:45    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

Nowadays, cars are only designed on computers, and we can only hope that any problems will be detected beforehand... otherwise, we'll be the ones who look foolish.
After the debacle with the first A-Class, Mercedes certainly had some serious discussions about it... although the rust problem seems to still not be completely resolved within the company.


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christians
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Post21-09-2007, 12:35    Subject: Mercedes vs. Physics: The Ultimate Showdown Quote

It's unusual, but I don't find that part to be concerning.
Gruß Christian
A6 BPP, Ex-A6 AKN (Gurke), Ex-Audi100 92 AAT (5Zyl.)


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