Infos zum Partikelfilter (viel Text!) | Posts 48+

Has anyone from the academic automotive community here ever conducted a study on this?
'...what a modern diesel engine is actually capable of in terms of fuel consumption and overall efficiency.'

Would one forgo the diesel particulate filter (DPF), selective catalytic reduction (SCR) system, exhaust gas recirculation (EGR), and a specific type of silencer?

Then, a modern diesel car with around 150 horsepower and an average weight of about 1500 kg should be capable of achieving phenomenal fuel consumption of 3-4 liters!

For me, these 'decadent' castrations within urban areas would only make sense where children play and people live, work, and eat...

But considering shipping, rail and road transport... considering the military, and of course not forgetting civilian aviation...
I believe that the American military alone emits about 10% of all unfiltered fossil diesel fuel/kerosene, while civil aviation accounts for another 20%, and freight transport makes up the rest.

and all of that, in a truly disgusting way!

I'm a bit concerned that the marginal fraction of emissions from diesel cars is being artificially inflated through such questionable actions. (But this has been discussed extensively regarding sources of particulate matter.)

One might almost think that every political issue put up for public discussion is a farce.
I don't know how you feel, but I, as a mindless piece of herd animal without a real sense of self, feel almost a little offended and mocked by the political machinations here in this Christian Western world.
Off-topic.
Please provide the German text you would like me to translate into English. I will then give you only the translation, without any explanations.
Just our so-called democratic system! As if there were any equality.
Whether the bitter cup I drink every day is red, green, yellow, or black.
I don't care!! The content remains the same, and so does the material of the chalice!!!
Do I really want to participate in this 'Diesel enthusiasts' discussion group regarding the DPF (diesel particulate filter) or a so-called 'election,' especially when everything seems arbitrary?
Bitte gib mir den deutschen Text, den du übersetzt haben möchtest.
OT off.

For me, this feels like 'bread and circuses,' a distraction from something we may not even be aware of.

But I think it's good that the 'surplus' of human beings here isn't wasted in staged wars or building large cathedrals, but rather in ways like this! It preserves my dignity! Yes, definitely .

My solution: An 'in-town/out-of-town' button on the dashboard...

Within city limits, all modern emission control systems engage, and a torque curve severely restricts the engine's power. However, outside of the city, the car is allowed to perform as it can, not just as it must!
That would be a consistent solution that I can live with.

The question of how to implement and ensure compliance with such a system is something that can certainly be discussed.

Nebelwerfer_TDI wrote:

... The stupid police officer (otherwise, why would he have become a police officer - very few do it out of idealism ) then wonders why it's not working and stops checking. In that kind of way, like "Damn thing, it's broken again."...and that's it

.

... he will simply stop your car, as there's no way to verify it. The next workshop will then have to fix it at your expense.

Ask the many truck drivers what they suffer under electronic monitoring. Is something wrong with the system? If so, the vehicle remains immobilized until proven otherwise. In such cases, a workshop must be called out at the driver's expense.

That's exactly how it should be for passenger cars as well.
You wouldn't believe all the things that are still coming our way in the next 15 years.

But considering the shipping industry.

Good keyword. I once read a report about the type of fuel that large ocean-going ships burn far out at sea. It's unfiltered heavy oil, rich in lubricating metals and sulfur. The engines are designed for this type of fuel. We're talking about gigantic two-stroke engines with DC injection and crossheads.

But what about AGR? DPF? Catalytic converter? NOx? I think the mechanic would burst out laughing and walk away.

Given the environmental burden that the brightly colored goods shipped from abroad (ranging from bananas to televisions) place on the planet, the outcry over the exhaust fumes of a few diesel cars in small Germany seems almost ridiculous.

The priority should be minimizing consumption, not imposing a questionable restriction on a particle source that accounts for only 5%.

Ha, the comparisons are starting to become increasingly inaccurate. Of course, large ships burn heavy fuel oil. What do you think the cost of Japanese/Taiwanese flexible plastic waste would be if they were running on diesel? By the way, they are forced to do so in coastal areas and, of course, in ports.

Okay, let's be honest. Just calculate the number of cars on the road and then their fuel consumption – it adds up to a significant amount.

It's truly tragic how politics approaches the particulate matter reduction project. However, they remain true to form. What matters is money. Therefore, a Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) is good because you can make three times as much: from VAT, vehicle tax, and the companies that manufacture them.

However, it should be clearly stated that fuel consumption in Germany could be significantly reduced with the current vehicle fleet and drivers who are more mindful of their vehicles. Why do people leave cars running in front of bakeries? Why do they constantly drive in third gear at 70 km/h? Why do people try to cover the 200 meters to the next traffic light in just 2 seconds?


Let's go back to that point. I believe that large two-stroke diesel engines using heavy fuel oil are not particularly a problem in terms of particulate matter emissions.

@Bertil: ... he's essentially telling you that your car is broken and won't be fixed, as it's not verifiable. The next workshop will then have to fix it at your expense.



I can't really imagine that, because he can't demand that I stay there on Friday evening and wait through (a possibly extended) weekend until a workshop has time on Monday, Tuesday, or Wednesday to pick up the car and repair it. Especially because not much will be left of the car if it's stranded on the highway .

And what if the error was due to a fault in his device? In many cases, they would have to face massive lawsuits for damages – for example, someone who relies on their car for work and suffers lost income as a result.

Here's something even worse that comes to mind: Simply disconnect the diagnostic interface from the vehicle's electronics and send a few high-voltage pulses through it. This will fry the police department's diagnostic adapter, and it won't work on other cars either - and then you can prove that the problem isn't with the car itself .

Why would someone leave a car running in front of a bakery? Why would someone drive at a constant speed of 70 kilometers per hour in third gear? Why does someone try to cover the 200 meters to the next traffic light in 2 seconds?



Who does that ?

Why would someone leave a car running in front of a bakery?


especially during times of open eastern borders .

Hello!

Nebelwerfer_TDI wrote:

I can't really imagine that happening,

since he can't demand that I stay there on Friday evening.

He can do it, and he does it!

Quote:

And what if the error was due to a problem with his device? Then, in many cases, they would have to face significant compensation claims – for example, lost income for someone who relies on their car for work.

Am Dienstwagen geht das Gerät, an den vorherigen Fahrzeugen ging das Gerät, an dem nach Dir angehalteten Fahrzeug geht das Gerät. NuI don't care about yours.
Lost income is irrelevant. For example, if you get pulled over by a speed camera, you definitely won't make your appointment on time. And the more you get upset about it, the longer the process will take.
If your car is not roadworthy or lacks the necessary operating permit and therefore needs to be taken off the road, you are not entitled to compensation for lost income because you should not have been driving the vehicle in the first place.

Quote:

Here's something even worse that comes to mind: Simply disconnect the diagnostic interface from the vehicle's electronics and send a few high-voltage pulses through it. This will fry the police department's diagnostic adapter, and it won't work on other cars either

.

Depending on the officials involved, this raises suspicion, and you're facing a very serious problem.

In the US, even more radical scenarios are being considered, where vehicles would automatically report errors to the licensing authority via a wireless network. While this is still futuristic, it clearly shows the direction in which emissions regulations are heading (unfortunately).

Quote:

Quote: Why would someone leave a car running in front of a bakery ? Who does that ?

Many people, especially in the winter, are affected by this. In addition to a fine for unauthorized idling, there is also a fine for "failure to secure the vehicle against theft" or "inciting a criminal offense" – due to gross negligence.


BYE
TDI mechanics.

Depending on the officials, he arouses suspicion, and you have a very big problem.


Please go ahead - they don't have that much upstairs , I know from experience; if you're driving a Golf and get stopped, hand the officer the vehicle documents for a Passat (different license plate), he walks around the car, looks at the inspection sticker and finds nothing; then he returns the papers and says 'thank you, have a good trip' - I think now you understand what kind of clueless people most police officers are . Of course, you can also get one who is competent and knowledgeable, but that should be more the exception than the rule.

In the USA, completely different scenarios are being considered; there is serious discussion about vehicle-to-everything communication. A vehicle automatically reports errors to the registration authority, etc. Although this is still futuristic, it clearly shows the direction in which emission regulations (unfortunately) are moving.


A radio transmitter can also be modified, as I have already mentioned - it's an arms race }.

Haha, the Americans and their fun ideas. I've already driven about 15,000 miles in cars. Even their mobile network coverage is incredibly low, at only 0.5%. Of course, there are also large areas where people live who don't even know what year it is and only know about telephones through hearsay. But they've always had great ideas, although nothing ever comes of them. I can imagine, though, that the Californians might launch a satellite called "Arnold1" to develop something like that. But what will they do with all those hordes of old, wrecked V8 pickup trucks?

If Bertil writes that the police's planned use of OBD diagnostics (i.e., what is likely being proposed) to locate stolen vehicles requires a reasonable suspicion before a regular police officer can access the port in the car, then there must first be some grounds for suspicion.

Allerdings sollte man nicht allen DIngen nur negativ gegenüberstehen. Im großen und ganzen ist es leider so, das der Autofahrer immer die Mutter aller politischen Geldbeschaffungs "kriminalitäten" bleiben wird und um uns milde zu stimmen, gibt es keine Geschwindigkeitsbegrenzung. NoI don't.
The good thing about it might be that the number of stolen vehicles continues to decrease. A cynic might think: Fewer cars being stolen = cheaper insurance!

"Idling a car in front of a bakery" is given as an example. Yesterday, I was stuck in traffic on the A45, and for 40 minutes, nothing moved. Next to me was a relatively new Mercedes SL with the top down. The guy inside kept the engine running the whole time, probably to cool his freshly blow-dried hair. That's what I mean when I broadly talk about resource waste.

At 0.7 liters per hour, I don't have any problems running it, especially during the winter.

especially with PD and their useless warmongers.

In the US, I once asked a truck driver why all those trucks are running while the drivers are inside eating, sleeping, showering, having sex, or doing whatever else they do at the 'truck stop.'

'Well, it's quite simple,' he said: 'Because when you fill up the tank completely, you get a free car wash!'


I know someone at the club who used to be a fighter pilot in the air force.

Subject: Armed F4 Phantom aircraft + wing tanks.
Task: Blow out the 25 cubic meters of kerosene that have been loaded in just 25 minutes, just to get a feel for it...


Who is making the 'flawed comparisons' here now?

I think you need to broaden your perspective and understand the scale of things.

I think you need to broaden your perspective and understand the dimensions.

I think 'ObenbeiMutti' is right; however, the people who rely on their cars every day are likely to be charged the most – as has already been pointed out here.

And then you shouldn't be surprised why the creativity of some people is shockingly high when it comes to circumventing something like that. Whether it's legal or illegal now depends on the observer. Those who have read '1984' by George Orwell will now understand what I mean... because if things continue this way, we will soon reach that level .

Welcome to my world, Nebelwerfer.

I think it's a perfect synergy between Orwell's '1984' and Huxley's 'Brave New World.'

Welcome to my world, Nebelwerfer.


and I was already afraid that I would be the only one who thinks like this .



''Brave New World'' by Huxley.

It has been lying around in my house for almost a year, and I haven't found the time to read it .

Nebelwerfer_TDI wrote:

... "Please, they don't have that much upstairs – I know from experience." ...

It's nice that you generalize things like that, and it's a shame if your "Greens" are really that shallow. In any case, I've definitely encountered some who immediately recognized what was wrong.

Nebelwerfer_TDI wrote:

Simply disconnect the diagnostic interface, which is controlled by the vehicle's electronics.

You can program the device in such a way that it detects when it is disconnected and also logs an error message.

Nebelwerfer_TDI wrote:

and send a few high-voltage pulses across it. This will fry the police diagnostic adapter, and it will no longer work on other cars either - thus proving that the problem is not with the car itself

.

And I will then pay for the new device with my tax money (and you too) .

Simply disconnect the diagnostic interface, which is controlled by the vehicle's electronics.

You can program the device such that it detects when it is being disconnected and also writes an error message.

How is the control unit supposed to detect when a passive cable end (the diagnostic connector) is disconnected via relay contacts? Perhaps the control unit sends high-frequency pulses and measures the duration of the reflection to register a change in cable length between the control unit and the connector? And this, considering the cost-cutting pressures in today's automotive industry .

and send a few high-voltage pulses across it. This will fry the police diagnostic adapter, and it will no longer work on other cars either - thus proving that the problem is not with the car itself .

That would be a rather foolish approach. Firstly, there is the risk of being caught and charged with offenses related to property damage. Secondly, interfaces against high-voltage lines with low energy can be easily protected, provided they are not already protected. With high-energy impulses (starting from strobe lights), it will spark and smoke, making the manipulation obvious.

A much smarter approach would be a compact device that emulates an entire control unit and presents itself to the diagnostic adapter as a perfect, exemplary vehicle. That would be a worthwhile 'arms race.'

Then, a modern diesel car with around 150 horsepower and an average weight of about 1500 kg should be capable of achieving phenomenal fuel consumption of 3-4 liters per 100 kilometers!!!!

Okay, let's not exaggerate too much. Let's take a look at the main cause of the high vehicle weight: Excessive passive safety features that are declared as standard by lobbying groups: side impact protection, rollover protection, rigidity, crumple zones... Nowadays, even a small car that a mother might use to buy bread is like a rolling fortress.

And it's not even enough: Even with the Dacia Logan, which is also considered one of these supposedly safe cars, ADAC complains about this or that 'safety flaw' – it's just completely out of touch!

A shift in thinking is needed here: We must simply accept that driving a car is dangerous, and that there's a risk of death or serious injury. And that a 'rolling fortress' cannot eliminate this problem, but can only minimally alleviate the symptoms.

There need to be affordable cars again, like the design of the original Golf. Truly cheap, truly 'unsafe,' and truly lightweight. A maximum curb weight of 700 kg must be the guiding principle for designing a compact car. In addition, ABS and two airbags (as a bonus), but no steel beams or similar heavy additions, just ordinary, thin sheet steel.

Here's the translation:

'This involves a moderately reduced engine power output, for example, 40 horsepower from a small 0.8-liter engine. Above 60 km/h and without favorable weather conditions (as detected by a weather sensor), the engine automatically operates in lean mixture mode, resulting in correspondingly high NOx emissions. This has no impact on NOx levels in rural areas.'

Then it would be possible to offer inexpensive cars with low fuel consumption, such as 4.XL gasoline or 3.XL diesel models, and a net price of less than €7,000.

Considering the cars that have been purchased (I've already seen two Touaregs and one Cayenne today), we are still far from truly high fuel prices. The current complaining is more of a privileged concern, as people want to maintain their existing high standard of automotive living (namely, not owning a car with a body like a Golf I and 40 horsepower).

It's only when there is demand for these types of cars (and that clearly isn't the case yet) that we can talk about truly high fuel prices.