Is an internet connection mandatory when accessing ECUs?

Hello again,

I haven't been active here for many years, as I've had a gasoline-powered Polo since 2014 and have only used VCDS very rarely. The gasoline car has now been sold because I was able to switch to an electric car (a 2023 MG4) thanks to my own rooftop solar power, a photovoltaic system, and a low annual mileage.
"To address this, I purchased a diagnostic tool that also supports TPMS. However, I discovered that it can only access the ECUs if there's an internet connection via LAN. This means I can start my journey from home with one ECU open and view live data, but I can't switch to any other ECU while on the road unless I have access to an open Wi-Fi hotspot." And I find that simply bad compared to VCDS.
The driver of a 2022 MG4 can access its ECUs using an older version of my diagnostic tool, even without an active Wi-Fi connection.
My well-informed neighbor claims that recently, several car manufacturers have been designing the software for their new models in such a way that an active internet connection is mandatory for accessing the ECUs (Electronic Control Units).

Is there any truth to the claim that there are multi-brand diagnostic tools available for around €1,000 that can, without an active internet connection, diagnose the ECUs (almost) of all manufacturers? Can I access live data?

Hi,
With whom is the diagnostic tool supposed to connect? My assumption is that it's intended to connect with the manufacturer of the diagnostic tool. Vehicle manufacturers typically only allow non-contracted workshops to access their systems under specific conditions (e.g., registration, paid access, software, etc.).
hg
Herbert.

Quote:

My assumption is that the manufacturer of the diagnostic tool is the one responsible.

It could certainly be the case. To test this, I plan to tap into cars belonging to people in my network soon. If I even need an internet connection to help the oldest ones, that supports your assumption .

Hello Ulf,

welcome. It's also possible that it's a form of copy protection for the tool, where certain things are executed online on a server.

Why not get a mobile phone plan with data? Of course, it's more convenient without it, no question. Ultimately, the success of these tools depends on the honesty of their users.

Best regards, Rainer.

Hi Rainer,
It's nice that you still recognize me .

"Just now, I tapped into the systems of three cars belonging to my neighbors using my tablet – initially without a Wi-Fi connection."
In a Mini Cabriolet that is approximately 14 years old and a Nissan Juke that is about 4 years old, all ECU error codes could be read without a Wi-Fi connection.
"On a Ford Mondeo, approximately 6 years old, I couldn't access the error memory without a Wi-Fi connection; I could only access it once I connected to Wi-Fi."

It seems my well-informed neighbor is right that, recently, several car manufacturers have been designing the software for new models in such a way that an active internet connection is required to access the ECUs.

According to this, my opinion is that the most likely consequence is that my 2023 MG4 can only be accessed and diagnosed "online," whereas the 2022 versions of the MG4 can still be accessed without an internet connection.

Hi Ulf,
I find it highly unlikely that a tool from "Meier & Schulze Enterprises Ltd." would contact various vehicle manufacturers by phone and establish a connection with them that allows access to ECUs. Head scratching .
Out of curiosity, what tools are you using, and what connections do you see, for example, on a firewall or with netstat?
hg
Herbert.

I also have a multi-brand tool that, for example, malfunctions with Ford vehicles if there is no internet connection.

Herbert wrote:

Out of curiosity - what tool do you have, and what connections do you see, for example, on a firewall or with netstat?

Hi Herbert,
I have an Autel MaxiCheck MX808S-TS.
For me, the concept of "telephoning" to a specific place would be completely unfamiliar. I don't have Netstat, but if Windows 10 or AVG logs this information by default, I could check to see if I find anything – if you tell me where to look.

Please provide the text you would like me to translate from German to English.

@Rainer
I, of course, also looked at your offer , but in the brand list, I didn't find either MG or SAIC (the Chinese company that bought the MG brand rights and now manufactures cars under that label). So, I then looked for other options https://shop.dieselschrauber.org/en/obd-diagnosegeraet-p-363.php.

Hi Ulf,
"netstat" is a Windows command, but it won't be useful for the tablet. In this case, you would need to monitor your Fritzbox (your router) to see who is connecting to whom.
I quickly found this https://praxistipps.chip.de/fritzbox-datenverkehr-mitschneiden_9989.

hg
Herbert.

Edit: TPMS = Tire Pressure Monitoring System

Well, Herbert,
I have a Speedport Smart3. Attached is the service menu, but I don't see a connection list or anything like that when I first look at it.

If you know something related to the Fritzbox tip, I will try to figure out where my diagnostic tool is communicating when opening the MG4 ECUs .

It seems to work with Speedport devices as well:

https://www.pcwelt.de/article/1160122/netzwerkdaten-mit-dem-speedport-router-mitschneiden.html

hg
Herbert.

Thank you for the link, Herbert. However, the article is from 2016...
If I have the time and inclination, I'll try it out and let you know the results.

Hi,
The topic likely falls under "Secure Gateway CGW," or SFD. Autel probably has a certification/license, and usage may incur an extra charge. The question is, how? Similar to the MaxiCheck manual: "Unlock the Gateway ECU: ...On the Purchase screen, tap OK. Select a payment method and complete the order to unlock the gateway." On the Purchase Successful screen, tap OK.

@ Rainer, how far along is Ross-Tech with this? SFD support was apparently added in version 21.9 (see revision history), but as a non-user, I don't know much about it. Is it possible to read a challenge token, obtain a deactivation token, and then read it? Every time, extra?

hg
Herbert.

Quote:

....Unlock the Gateway ECU: ...On the Purchase screen, tap OK. Select a payment method and complete the order to unlock the gateway. On the Purchase Successful screen, tap OK.

Hmmm... the text dialogue with the altar is amusingly mixed with German and English. But if I had ever seen something like Purchase or Pay somewhere, I would have stopped first instead of continuing.
Currently, I assume that I have paid for the license usage as a fixed amount included in the purchase price .

BTW: Apparently, without creating a user account with Autel, including the tablet's serial number and password, you are only allowed to use the device 10 times. I've encountered such a warning at least once, probably because I accidentally activated an option like "work without an account."

It could be like that.
hg
Herbert.

Here's a quick update:

The tablet's constant need for a Wi-Fi connection used to annoy me, but now it only bothers me a little, since I discovered the "vehicle hotspot" function and now use it as a routine for diagnostic work.
"This way, I can also start diagnoses while on the go, as long as the MG4 has a network connection."

Meanwhile, it has been 1 year since I bought the tablet, my software update subscription has expired, and consequently, I can no longer open any ECUs, even though supposedly no functions have been disabled on the tablet:

Quote:

Even if you do not renew your software, your Autel diagnostic tablet will continue to function perfectly. Diagnostic and service functions remain available; no software has been removed. All manufacturer-related software updates that were downloaded to your tablet and VCI are still present. The entire Android and Autel MaxiSYS firmware is present and functioning as before. However, depending on the brand, model, and year of the vehicles you are servicing, you may need an active Autel subscription to complete the work...

.
Then Autel will likely handle the online access authorization to the ECUs of my MG4, as long as I have an active software subscription.
That only costs 300€ per year - a beautiful new world. https://autel-us.translate.goog/autel-oncall/?_x_tr_sl=en&_x_tr_tl=de&_x_tr_hl=de&_x_tr_pto=rq