Problems reading measurement blocks from 1Z engine

Hello,

The fuel flow meter on my classic Audi 80 1Z, manufactured in 1993, needs to be resealed.
Thanks to this instruction manual, the VAG-COM that was purchased in this house 2 years ago, and the worry-free gasket set, it shouldn't be a problem - one would think.

The connection between VAG-COM and the control unit via the Rossmann adapter works, although it is slower than with my other Audi 80 1Z from 1995. Reading error codes, VP setting graphic is working.

There are only problems when reading the vehicle's diagnostic data.
- MWB 0 can be read with 10 fields.
- MWB 1 and all subsequent ones cannot be read (message: ... not found).

Individual measurements can be retrieved ('channels'), but what do they tell me?

Additional information:
VAG-COM Version RKS 704.1
The control unit reports the following: TN: 8A0907401B BT: 1.91R4EDCA23D09.
"The 'label file' is not found where it is needed."

The following information is needed: MWB 1, field 2 (mg/dose) and field 3 (RSW).

Question: What do I need to do to achieve these two values?
- Do I need to update the software/adapter?
- Different software settings / different PC?
- Can I also find the values I'm looking for under the 'individual measurements'?
(I would appreciate an explanation of what the 'individual readings' are, as I haven't found any particular correlation with the values from MWB 0, which is the only data that can be read out.)

Thank you for your help. I would be very reluctant to stop using my "classic" car, which has been running perfectly well for 620,000 km, just because of a leaking fuel pump...

VAG-COM Version RKS 704.1

Try a more current version .

mullemaus wrote:

Try a more recent version

"It won't do anything, Mulle. It seems he has a very old, basic engine control unit, and it only supports a maximum boost pressure of 0."

Problem 2: You probably still have the old Poti pump in there, which isn't really designed to be disassembled. Therefore, it doesn't matter that you don't have the values.

Thank you for the reminder; I was negligent with the updates because I assumed the new features would be more evident in the tracking of current vehicles.
(2 minutes for the first answer - excellent )

Quote:

It won't do anything, Mulle, he apparently has such an old 1Z engine control unit, and it only supports MWB 0.

... bad news.

Is it possible to obtain the desired data from the individual measurement values?

8A0907401B

mullemaus wrote:

8A0907401B

I don't recall the part number for that MWB 0 STG off the top of my head. Do you happen to know now?

Quote:

Problem 2: You probably still have the old potentiometer pump installed, which isn't really designed to be disassembled. Therefore, it doesn't matter that you don't have the values.

... I also don't want to disassemble the MSW, because it's working perfectly, with absolutely no hesitation. Only the seal between... Pump housing and MSW are leaking.

Hello,

I'm afraid the only thing we can do is record the value for the injection quantity in measurement block 0 before disassembling it. If the tooltip in the label file (so please update it) doesn't indicate which individual field that is, the first task would be to figure that out.
Fields 2 and 9 are definitely not the ones, as those represent fuel temperature and actual injection timing.
I'm guessing that field 1 represents the motor speed (0 when the motor is not running).

When you turn on a high-power electrical device (e.g., headlights and rear window defroster), the fuel injection amount should increase, while the other values should remain almost the same. It should be possible to quickly determine which field represents the injection amount.

Best regards, Rainer.

You don't need to write down any values when using the Poti-Pump. The flow meter in this case has a particular feature: it is not adjustable. After the initial calibration at the factory, the position of the flow meter relative to the pump body is fixed using a type of resin.

Hello,

Thank you for the interesting advice. Today, after work, we'll be testing the new VCDS version; I've already downloaded it.

Quote:

With the Poti-Pump, you don't need to write down any values. The quantity control valve has a particular feature here: it cannot be adjusted or moved.

.... that's interesting.

Now, it would be interesting to see how the epoxy resin situation is. On the motor side of the MSW housing, there's a flat protrusion, about 6mm thick, with an 8mm hole in it. This hole is not completely through; it's partially blocked with a hemispherical cavity, and it's marked in red. Could that be the resin, shaped like a "resin pin," that protrudes into a hole in the pump housing, thereby preventing any movement?

If that's the case, then the MSW should simply be removable and reinstallable... provided that one manages not to break the resin pin .

And then, of course, the question arises whether the commercially available sealing set for the 'standard' VP37 also fits the potentiometer-equipped VP37... it would be annoying if the issue is unclear and then the seal is missing .

My product code is 2 467 010 003.

Thank you for all the feedback.

Team100 wrote:

Now it would be interesting to see how the epoxy resin situation looks. On the drive side of the MSW housing, there is a flat protrusion, about 6mm thick, with an 8mm hole in it. This hole is not completely through; it is hemispherical and hollow, closed off by 2/3, and marked in red. Could that be the resin, shaped like a "resin pin," that protrudes into a hole in the pump housing, thereby preventing any movement? If that's the case, then the MSW should simply be removable and reinstallable... provided that one manages not to break the resin pin

.

Yes, that's exactly it. I couldn't have explained it better.
The "Dichtungssatz" (gasket set) fits both the Poti and HDK models, but the "WeDi" (20mm) must be ordered separately.

Brief update:

- Installed new VCDS version 908.2.
- No change when reading the vehicle data: Only vehicle data module 0 can be read.
"Difference identified: Instead of 'Label file not found', the message now reads 'Label file REDIRECT failed'."

According to Rainer's instructions, I have taken a closer look at the existing fields (unlabeled - no tooltips) of the readable MWB 0.

Result: Field 4 reacts to loads at idle by consuming power, suggesting it indicates the fuel injection amount (value 20 at idle, value 26 under load).

In the attached document, I have created an Excel table that shows the standstill time, the motor LL (likely referring to a specific motor type or measurement) after a cold start, and then after a 20-minute warm-up period, both with and without load. Field 3 changes based on the pressure applied to the accelerator pedal.

Possibly, someone might need these values: For the Excel table.

slow-moe wrote:

Yes, that's exactly how it is. I couldn't have explained it better. The "Dichtungssatz" (gasket set) fits both the Poti and HDK models, but the WeDi (20mm) must be ordered separately.

Thank you for the hint. Tomorrow, the MSW (municipal solid waste) system will be disassembled, and the seal will be replaced.

Hopefully, the resin sealant and the injection volume determination from VCDS will prevent any issues.

Here's a brief success story and an overview of the process:

- Marking: To do this, I used a fine triangular file to create notches on both sides. It's difficult to mark accurately because the pump housing is slightly curved.
- Decommissioning the MSW is not a problem.
- The standard VP37 gasket set can be used with a minor modification: The triangular protrusion, approximately 5mm long, must be cut off - both from the MSW unit and from the lid.
- The built-in lid gasket has a different design: it's thicker and doesn't have any ridges. The new gasket is thinner, has ridges, and fits after the triangle is cut off.
- The resin plug is conical in shape and approximately 16mm in diameter and 7mm high in the area of the pump housing, thus minimizing the risk of breakage during removal.
- Reinstalling the MSW and inserting the pin into the hole in the adjusting ring is quite tricky . The ring tends to rotate easily, and gravity already causes it to twist so that the hole faces sideways and is inaccessible to the pin. It's possible that the ring in the pump, which has already been used for 620,000 km, is unusually "loose" or "movable."

However, a thin copper wire can prevent the automatic twisting of the ring. Inserting the pin, however, can only be done with a delicate touch, as the resin cone of the potentiometer pump limits the freedom of movement of the MSW.

Here, having a keen sense of hearing also helped: turning off the radio and working in the evenings meant complete silence. Once the pin is correctly positioned in the hole, and the MSW is moved 1mm longitudinally and laterally, a metallic clinking sound can be heard as the pin strikes the hole in the adjusting ring.

- Tightening: The cone does not prevent the MSW from pivoting on the other side, so check the notch there. Be careful with the casting resin cone: Do not allow it to be forced against the MSW's guide by the pressure of the screws in the elongated holes; it could be squeezed and damaged, preventing it from being flush. Always check the alignment by looking at the notches when tightening.

- The VP37 was degassed using a vacuum pump.
- Start with the precautions described in section 5. Engine running, clutch disengaged, ready to stall.
- Instant start without any hesitation, smooth idle. Short test drive, no issues.

- Control with VCDS: Field 4 now shows a value of 23 for the warm engine at idle, whereas it showed a value of 20 before the sealing work was performed.

Unfortunately, I lack the knowledge of how to convert these numerical values into mg/dose, and whether that conversion would still be within the acceptable tolerance range. Perhaps an expert here knows whether we should adjust the value back to the original '20' or if it can remain as it is.


Thank you to everyone who helped keep my classic car, with 620,000 km on the odometer, alive .

Hello,
In my case, field 4 represents the fuel injection amount (Avant B4 4/94, MSA12). According to the guidelines, values between 10 and 45 are considered normal (well, sort of).
You might be able to check the fuel mixture adjustment by observing the idle behavior. With the engine warm, give it a quick throttle blip and observe how the RPM drops. The fuel pump is slightly too rich if the engine initially reaches around 1000 RPM and then gradually returns to idle. (See also one of the guides here). If it doesn't shake or move, then everything is okay.
Okay, I understand. Please provide the German text you would like me to translate into English. I will only provide the translation.
Herbert.

Hello friends, I also have the same car model. In addition to the diesel issue, I think the MSW (Motronic System Board) needs to be opened and cleaned because the car is shaking at 1400 RPM. The team has proven that the MSW can be disassembled on these 93 models, but can they also be opened and cleaned? Thank you in advance.

Hello,

Yes, it's fundamentally similar, see the instructions for disassembling the quantity setting device!

Sure, here's the translation:

"LG" translates to "Best regards" or "Sincerely" in English.